Try it and find out.

Whichever fits your darts better.

Not only that, but it's one of those wooden rulers with metal on one side. You know, the ones you always fantasized about using like machetes.

The same kinds of barrels that work with any air pressure gun. Read Cxwq's barrel selection article on this site. Brass, copper or PETG. Whatever fits your darts best and doesn't have much friction.

Question 1:

At the LANOS/YANOS it's all about the honor system. 90% of the time it works flawlessly and the games are fun. You get the occasional dickhead who doesn't count hits, or insists that he hit you even when you could see he wasn't looking. Those people simply get berated and are not invited back. We pride ourselves on our ability to have 30+ person wars without any cheating. Usually you don't feel the hit, unless it's a powerful gun, so it is up to the shooter to inform the person that they were hit. Our guys our trained to take the shooters word for it and we try to be honest. If neither is really sure ("I think I hit you." "Did you, I'm not sure") then usually neither will count the hit and just go on with the game. We just try to keep things fun and not super competitive, thats why we rotate teams every battle or two.

With some groups this honor system doesn't work. It all comes down to having strong leadership, and developing a core group of "regulars" who always play fair and are fun to have around.

The weights I use are slingshot pellets. They are 1/4" size steel slingshot pellets that you can buy near the gun rack at Wal-Mart. They come in packs of 200 I think. Sometimes Wal-Mart only has the 3/8" size though which obviously won't work. They're the perfect Stefan weights IMO.

Oh my god.

I'm sorry I no-showed at the war. I think this is the first LANO/YANO I have missed, ever. Like, in their entire 8 year history.

I ate something bad on Saturday and spent most of today shitting myself senseless. I wanted to die. I had made a ton of darts too.

Sorry I wasn't answering my phone, I really didn't feel like talking. In fact, for most of the day, my ass did the talking for me.

Let's please have another YANO soon, I can't tell you how pissed off I am.

>sigh<

Yea it varies according to your group. Out here we play in organized wars with specific sport-like rules regarding hits, counting, boundaries, etc. Other groups use different rules though usually they're just slight variations. The "standard" rule-set (also called West Coast rules) is that when you get hit you are momentarily out (usually counting to 20 seconds or so) and then back in, after a set number of lives you are dead for the round. The other major rule-set is East Coast style where there is no stopping between hits, and every single dart (rather than just the first dart as in West Coast) counts as a hit, so if someone hits you with a 4 shot Powerclip spray, you're down 4 hit points. After you lose all your hit points you're dead for the round. West Coast style tends to be slower and more strategic with occasional intense firefights, whereas East Coast is...well....not for the faint of heart.

There are other wars such as Capture the Flag (CTF), last man standing etc, but those kinds of wars vary much more in rules between groups than the standart "team deathmatch" type wars.

Groups who just kind of show up and shoot each other randomly are pretty lame.

When it comes to paintball and airsoft, most nerfers like paintball and/or airsoft, but few paintall/airsofters like nerf. Most of us like those sports, but just can't afford to play it very often or, such as in my case, suck really badly at it. That and it's just fun to be able to modify and completely customize your arsenal to your play style.

Oh, well I'm sorry but you've already been marked absent. Try to be here on time from now on.

Two or three springs in a BBB? Good God.....

You just can't go wrong with the AT3K, I mean really, it's like the perfect assault gun size. Six semi-auto shots, excellent mod possibilities, and it's like $20. The AT4K is too big and ungainly, and the AT2K, while an excellent gun, is only $5 cheaper than the AT3K for 2 fewer shots, and no auto-rotation.

Yea mine got 10 feet out of the box as well, par for the course. Mod that bad boy and you'll be impressed.

Black Scout: Yea you may suck at modding, it sounds like you had WAY too many bands on there. Or a broken PC.

Mason: You've got it backwards there actually. Banding you're PC's bladder will increase rate of fire and have virtually NO effect on range. The reason for this is that the pressure of the air inside the bladder does NOT determine the pressure of the air blast to the dart. The pressure in the bladder drives the mechanism on top back and forth. Using a system of springs and valves inside that mechanism, the reciprocating (back and forth) motion creates an air burst that goes to the dart. Therefore, increasing bladder pressure will increase the rate that the mechanism moves back and forth, which increases rate of fire. However the air burst pressure will remain virtually the same. To increase range you'd need to somehow replace or strengthen the internal spring in the mechanism (which is impossible, since it's all completely fused together), or increase the resistance when the mechanism moves BACK. I tried using bands for this but it didn't work too well, rubber bands have a very pronounced resistance curve. What I mean by that is that their resistance to stretching varies widely according to how much it's already stretched. Whereas springs have pretty much the same resistance no matter how compressed they are.

I tried to make all of that understandable, but it's easier to show than explain.

I just break it off. I like to break things.

Argh. No you don't have to replace it, it's purely cosmetic. Just pry the fucker off.

I'm old and out of shape, but I'll be there to fuck shit up.

 

Oh, and it's Dr. Spoon now bitches.

 

\m/

That still wouldn't help much, as it wouldnt' change the volume of air delivered per pump, which is what I'd be trying to improve on the AT4K.

Dude, ask the LCM, I totally went gun kata all over them last war. Fortunately when the dvd comes out I'll already have my new tv. Can you say 50" rear projection LCD? That combined with my 6.1 channels of surround sound goodness should make for an enjoyible viewing experience, better than the theatre.

VACC

I'm going to steal your home theater system Vacc. And if you try to stop me, I'll kick you in the nads. So be it.

Integrations are pretty useless IMO (which is ironic, seeing as how I was the first one to do an integration). The AT4K is definately a lot more uncomfortable to pump, although it's handle and trigger are better. Also, PETGing 12 barrels would just be a huge pain in the ass. Still, I'm going to try to do it for Armageddon, even if I don't personally use the gun.

Not over an Airzone. Seriously man, what got into you?!

I think I missed something....

Ok, so the AT3K arrived a few days ago and the AT4K arrived today. I havn't taken apart either yet, but have been considering mod possibilities on them and bouncing some ideas off of Cxwq. Here are my first impressions of the guns STOCK:

AT3K: Unmodded, it has NO power, nothing. It gets literally 10 feet on 3 pumps (any more and the overpressure release valve kicks in). The overpressure valve in this gun (at least in mine) is very weak, and will let air out after about 2 1/2 pumps. Plug it, and you should see a exponential increase in range and power. Replace the barrels and the gun should rock. I do not at all doubt claims of 80' flat with brass barrels. The barrel rotation mechanism works like a fucking BMW, I've abused it in every way possible, pumping REALLY fast and hard, pumping very very slowly, holding the trigger and just pumping over and over, and it's never skipped or failed to rotate once, it's clean and reliable. Definately exciting since I plan to replace the barrels with 5" brass ones, as near as I can tell it should definately not have any problems. The handle is pretty small, my pinky kinda falls off, and the trigger keeps pinching my finger a bit, but nothing major. The pump handle has a VERY short length of travel, and the handle is smooth so if your hands are sweaty you'll have a hard time holding on. I'm going to slap some grip-tape on it and that should help. If you want to replace the pump you'll have to watch out for the barrel rotation mechanism catch, as I think it's a mechanical latch that rotates the barrels. Overall the gun is compact, sturdy and (once modded) should provide decent power and accuracy, with great reliability. This will probably become my new main gun.

AT4k: This one just came today, but my opinions on it are pretty clear. I was actually pleasantly suprised. First off, it's big. About the size of a older model SM 3k, although a lot of that size extends backwards past the handle. The handle BTW is huge and very comfortable for people with larger hands, it actually really feels like the handle of a rifle or something, and the trigger as well is larger and easier to use. The pump however is even worse than on the AT3K and grip tape is practically a necessity to pump with any ease. Suprisingly enough the AT4K unmodded has about twice the range of a unmodded AT3K, with much better power. Still not powerful enough for most nerf wars, but you probably wouldn't get slaughtered with 12 shots at your disposal. The overpressure release valve seems a lot tighter on the AT4K. The barrel rotation mechanism works very well, but just doesn't feel quite as sturdy as the AT3K's, and you have to move the pump handle ALL the way forward to engage the rotation catch, which during very fast pumping could cause problems by not moving the handle forward enough. It's definately reliable enough for stock use, but put 12 5" brass barrels on there and I just doubt it would work as well. However once Cxwq gets some of that PETG tubing he mentioned in the Trading forum, that stuff may well prove to be perfect due to it's incredibly light weight. My dream mod for this gun would be to replace the barrels with PETG tubing and replace the pump with a larger one, such as a Powerclip's pump as per Cxwq's suggestion. With the approximately triple air capacity of the PC's pump over this one, you would only need one pump per shot, effectively turning the AT4K into a 12 shot pump action shotgun/rifle. It would be awesome. You would however need to make sure that the new pump handle would still make the barrels rotate properly. Overall I wouldn't say it has the "everyman" gun potential that the AT3K has, but properly modded the AT4K may well put a great many people in their place on the battlefield.

Now with the liquid guage thing....I actually can see some use for it, I mean it tells you if you've pumped or not and thats not bad, but does it detract from the air pressure of the shot? Or is the liquid guage a different pressure system than the main pressure tank. I don't want to drain the fluid to get more tank space, I want as little tank space as possible (within reason) to maximize the overall pressure. Can I just bypass the liquid tank entirely and connect the hose directly to the pressure tank? Would that help/hinder? What about other mods you've tried or would want to try to the AT3K or AT4K? Discuss.

1: I use a small thin screwdriver and a old rag and just scoop the shit out. You're right, you can't leave it in.

2: It goes right where the rotation mechanism fits onto the airtank. It seals the connection between the rotation mechanism and the pressure chamber.

You probably didn't put it together correctly. Make sure the catch piece is in the right place.

Ok.....that was quite an asshole of a comment.

Buy a Max Shot.

While the SM1000 was definately the most powerful of the Supermaxx line, what caused most of the jams in my opinion wasn't the long barrel, but the chamber rotation mechanism. If the dart didn't fire all the way and you tried to fire again, it would jam the gun and eat your dart.

I also don't think that the BBB is more powerful than a well modded AT3K. Stock, yes the BBB has much more power, but even when well modded a BBB can't match the accuracy and range of the AT3K brass or PETG modded. Innaccuracy IMO was always a problem of the BBB.

It is also my belief that Vacc is a Grade-A Poopiehead.

Tape won't do a damn thing. Run a metal rod along the length of the shaft and epoxy it in place. Use a LOT of epoxy. Make sure the rod doesn't stick out past the plastic otherwise it may not fit in the gun right. It will also make the plunger considerably heavier so you'll need to use more tension.

The Maximizer used a completely different internal spring and catch mechanism than the Max Shots. It was basically a mini-Ultimator, using a large extension spring and a ratcheting catch mechanism which was similar in theory to the Max Shot, but a different design. Had a lot more air delivery volume as well, but not at as high a pressure.

....ok look, about the condom hat, I've told you before, the spermicide makes my hair all frizzy.....

Same pressure, are you joking? The tank on a Wildfire (which is a rubber bladder that inflates) is probably 1/5th the pressure inside the tank of a pumped 1500 (which has a solid thick plastic tank). Putting the wildfire's bladder into a 1500 (even if you managed to do it practically) would just result in a long, weak burst of air.

When I first read the topic, all I could think of was the asian guy in "Major League 2" saying to the big black guy "Marbles! You have no marbles!"

I know this post is old but I always love how nobody ever thanks Cxwq, even though he's the one pretty much leading the NIC these days.

Yea, basically the gun just plain fires high. Always does. You just have to adjust for it. Most people can get used to it after a while, to this day I NEVER have been able to, which is why I don't use a LnL.

Take your gun to the hardware store, try springs out until you find one you like. Most hardware stores will let you return things even if they are opened, as long as you have the packaging. Just buy all the springs that might possibly work, find the one that works best, and return the rest.

Dude, barricades would totally own. We need something to spice up that location anyway and this sounds perfect. Ray if you took the time to make all the barricades like that, I would....like.....well lets just say I'd make it worth your while.