603 replies to this topic

[Salmon]

The metal tipped dart comment reminds me; I sometimes make "tack darts" with thumbtacks used as a tip(sharp-end down, of course). They don't hurt too much, and fly a lot farther and are much more consistent than other darts, besides CS darts. I was wondering if any wars would ever allow them?

[Ubermensch]

Many people have made darts this way. Just cover the metal tack with hot glue and make sure it's secure.

[Salmon]

Many people have made darts this way. Just cover the metal tack with hot glue and make sure it's secure.

Well, the whole reason I make/made them this way is because it takes away the trouble of making a dome and therefore makes the darts more consistent since they all have the same tip and weight. The reason I tend to not like CS darts is that they always tend to fly 15 or 20 feet less than regular stefans, while for some reason(weight?) the tack darts fly at least 10 feet more, usually. Plus thumbtacks are much more easily available and much cheaper than felt discs and washers.

EDIT: I'm talking about the kind of tack dart in "The mother of all dartsmithing tutorials", here.

Edited by Salmon, 22 November 2008 - 12:18 PM.

[Ubermensch]

That's the kind I was talking about.

[analogkid]

I've got a question, and this is the place to ask it:

I've just made a bunch of darts. I used the hairdryer to get them to the precise size I want them. It's been a couple days, and I've noticed that the darts have shrunken back to their original diameter. I have tried re-heating them with a hairdryer, bet they will either get messed up, or they will soon afterwards return to their original diameter. The darts still work great, but they will fall out if the gun is pointed down for too long. So I ask you, is there some sort of a way to permanently keep my darts at the perfect size, or will they continue shrinking?

Since no one else answered your question,
My theory:

The reason that they expand is because FBR has little cells where trapped gases are stored. I wanna say that the gas that they use is some kinda nitrogen compound, but I don't remember, and its not relevant anyway. So when you use the hairdryer, the darts are heated, and the gas inside expands a little. The foam stretches to accommodate the higher volume of the gas, and the diameter increases. When they cool, the gas returns to its original volume, but the foam stays stretched. There is no longer pressure being applied to the walls of the foam cells though, so the darts fit looser in barrels. There is no way I know of to permanently change the fit though.

[Accord]

Many people have made darts this way. Just cover the metal tack with hot glue and make sure it's secure.

Well, the whole reason I make/made them this way is because it takes away the trouble of making a dome and therefore makes the darts more consistent since they all have the same tip and weight. The reason I tend to not like CS darts is that they always tend to fly 15 or 20 feet less than regular stefans, while for some reason(weight?) the tack darts fly at least 10 feet more, usually. Plus thumbtacks are much more easily available and much cheaper than felt discs and washers.

EDIT: I'm talking about the kind of tack dart in "The mother of all dartsmithing tutorials", here.

Wait, so thumb tack stefans fly farther than normal, great quality stefans with either 3/0 or 1/4" weights in them?

[Salmon]

Many people have made darts this way. Just cover the metal tack with hot glue and make sure it's secure.

Well, the whole reason I make/made them this way is because it takes away the trouble of making a dome and therefore makes the darts more consistent since they all have the same tip and weight. The reason I tend to not like CS darts is that they always tend to fly 15 or 20 feet less than regular stefans, while for some reason(weight?) the tack darts fly at least 10 feet more, usually. Plus thumbtacks are much more easily available and much cheaper than felt discs and washers.

EDIT: I'm talking about the kind of tack dart in "The mother of all dartsmithing tutorials", here.

Wait, so thumb tack stefans fly farther than normal, great quality stefans with either 3/0 or 1/4" weights in them?

I never claimed that my stefans are of "great quality", but they fly better IN MY EXPERIENCE than MY normal stefans or CS stefans. Plus they are, as before stated, quite a bit easier to make, or at least cheaper(I can get like 60 tacks for a buck, while a package of 40 3/0 fishing weights is 4 dollars).

[Salmon]

I never claimed that my stefans are of "great quality", but they fly better IN MY EXPERIENCE than MY normal stefans or CS stefans. Plus they are, as before stated, quite a bit easier to make, or at least cheaper(I can get like 60 tacks for a buck, while a package of 40 3/0 fishing weights is 4 dollars).

Washers of the same weight and approximate diameter would have to work as well. Might be cheaper, might not, but sure wouldn't require as many excuses.

I don't particularly appreciate your sarcasm, but nonetheless, Bob, let's not turn this into a flamewar or anything(which is where it looks like it is headed).
My reasons for using tacks instead of washers are as follows:

-With tacks, there is no worry about making a dome, since it the tack is already dome-shaped.
-It's nearly impossible to get a tack off-center, unlike typical hot glue and fishing weight stefans.
-At least for me, tacks are much cheaper. A box of 60 tacks, as before stated, is only 1 dollar, while 30-something washers is 2 dollars, 20 felt washers is around two-fifty, and 40 fishing weights is at least 3 dollars depending on which store you go to.
-Easier to find(usually)
-For some reason, IN MY EXPERIENCE, once again, tack darts tend to fly a little further and go faster than other darts THAT I MAKE. But maybe I just suck at making darts.

So, back to my question, if you were hosting a war, would you allow tack-tipped darts as seen in this tutorial?

Edited by Salmon, 23 November 2008 - 12:10 PM.

[Split]

I would never allow tack darts, and would never want to be in a war that did. Weights and tips shoot out of guns (especially air guns) all the time, this is not a weight I EVER want to be flying at me. Especially in the winter, when the cold temperatures weaken the glue's bond to the tack.

As for cost, I got these, and at $12 shipped for 700 weights ($.017 each), they're basically the same cost as your tacks ($.0167 each), and are very easy to work with. The felt washers are also bought in bulk from mcmaster, throwing your prices off by a lot as well ($5.89 for 500 means $.01178 each, washers at $4.59 for 585 means $.0078 each, total of $.01958 each + shipping).

How are tack darts easier to find?

Going faster and flying further go in hand, but it's also pretty likely that the tack weighs less than a normal fishing weight, and that difference would cause a slight increase in velocity (and therefore range). If you wanted the same effect from a fishing weight dart, just use bb weight instead of 3/0. The reason we do use 3/0s over bb weights in our guns is that accuracy increases from a more front heavy and therefore stable dart.

Edited by Splitlip, 23 November 2008 - 12:51 PM.

[Ubermensch]

Maybe he meant that thumbtacks are easier to find in stores.

[Salmon]

I would never allow tack darts, and would never want to be in a war that did. Weights and tips shoot out of guns (especially air guns) all the time, this is not a weight I EVER want to be flying at me. Especially in the winter, when the cold temperatures weaken the glue's bond to the tack.

As for cost, I got these, and at $12 shipped for 700 weights ($.017 each), they're basically the same cost as your tacks ($.0167 each), and are very easy to work with. The felt washers are also bought in bulk from mcmaster, throwing your prices off by a lot as well ($5.89 for 500 means $.01178 each, washers at $4.59 for 585 means $.0078 each, total of $.01958 each + shipping).

How are tack darts easier to find?

Going faster and flying further go in hand, but it's also pretty likely that the tack weighs less than a normal fishing weight, and that difference would cause a slight increase in velocity (and therefore range). If you wanted the same effect from a fishing weight dart, just use bb weight instead of 3/0. The reason we do use 3/0s over bb weights in our guns is that accuracy increases from a more front heavy and therefore stable dart.

Tacks are easier to find, usually, since you can find them at almost any general store. I don't like buying stuff online usually, also, but thank you for the links. And personally a tack dart has never lost it's tip being shot out of any of my guns, including a pump-shotty, but then again, it doesn't get very cold down here in Texas. Thanks for the helpful reply.

[/question]

Edited by Salmon, 23 November 2008 - 06:08 PM.

[nerfnut23]

I realized that using lead hunting pellets helps get a great dome. But whatever you do, don't let the point stick through the hot glue.

[minsc]

Tacks are easier to find, usually, since you can find them at almost any general store. I don't like buying stuff online usually, also, but thank you for the links. And personally a tack dart has never lost it's tip being shot out of any of my guns, including a pump-shotty, but then again, it doesn't get very cold down here in Texas. Thanks for the helpful reply.

Salmon, just stop using them please, because they may not have broken yet, but they will eventually, and will most likely ruin someones day. I used to make darts in a similar way, using 7/8 in. roofing nails. Like you, my darts never lost their tip, because I put hot glue on the tip before putting it in the dart. However, do this for me really quick. Take one dart, and squeeze it off center so it bends in half. The sharp point inside the dart will quickly puncture through the soft foam and be exposed. Now imagine that instead of squeezing it with your fingers, it is lying in the grass tip down, and your foot lands on one. Not fun.

[silentsnipe]

Your right salmon, I use the thumbtacks too. They work very well. Very well indeed. Very cheap. Easy to find. The works.

[Salmon]

Tacks are easier to find, usually, since you can find them at almost any general store. I don't like buying stuff online usually, also, but thank you for the links. And personally a tack dart has never lost it's tip being shot out of any of my guns, including a pump-shotty, but then again, it doesn't get very cold down here in Texas. Thanks for the helpful reply.

Salmon, just stop using them please, because they may not have broken yet, but they will eventually, and will most likely ruin someones day. I used to make darts in a similar way, using 7/8 in. roofing nails. Like you, my darts never lost their tip, because I put hot glue on the tip before putting it in the dart. However, do this for me really quick. Take one dart, and squeeze it off center so it bends in half. The sharp point inside the dart will quickly puncture through the soft foam and be exposed. Now imagine that instead of squeezing it with your fingers, it is lying in the grass tip down, and your foot lands on one. Not fun.

Well, minsc, that's why you don't nerf barefoot! And a tack with a half-centimeter spike isn't going to pierce through a shoe sole. Far less if two-thirds of that spike is covered by foam the foam it's piercing through, if that ever happens.

And also, and I know this isn't my thread, but I thought I said [/question]?

Edited by Salmon, 29 November 2008 - 11:44 PM.

[boom1]

Quick question who invented the stefan?

[Ubermensch]

An old Canadian nerfer named Stefan Mohr.

[boom1]

An old Canadian nerfer named Stefan Mohr.

Realy if thats true I am not suprised.About the candian thing not the name.

[TantumBull]

What's heavier 3/0 fishing weights or 1/4" steelshot slingshot bb's? I've heard both answers. Also, are 3/0 fishing weights and 3/0 splitshot fishing weights the same thing?

[Icespartan 1114]

What's heavier 3/0 fishing weights or 1/4" steelshot slingshot bb's? I've heard both answers. Also, are 3/0 fishing weights and 3/0 splitshot fishing weights the same thing?

1/4" steel slingshot is heavy then 3/0, but only a little bit. Although I have seen some huge ass 1/4 steel slingshot weights, if you have ever ordered steel slingshot weights from Blacksunshine they are these gold colored weights and there like 2 times size of the usual 1/4" slingshot weights I use.

[Draconis]

What's heavier 3/0 fishing weights or 1/4" steelshot slingshot bb's? I've heard both answers. Also, are 3/0 fishing weights and 3/0 splitshot fishing weights the same thing?

1/4" steel slingshot is heavy then 3/0, but only a little bit. Although I have seen some huge ass 1/4 steel slingshot weights, if you have ever ordered steel slingshot weights from Blacksunshine they are these gold colored weights and there like 2 times size of the usual 1/4" slingshot weights I use.

Now, this is just the way it works in Oregon, but... Wouldn't 1/4" slingshot ammo be 1/4" in diameter? Otherwise it would be *drumroll* NOT 1/4".

You're right salmon, I use the thumbtacks too. They work very well. Very well indeed. Very cheap. Easy to find. The works.

You won't be using those at PWN, methinks. That's a good way to lose a testicle. You know, when I kick you in them after being poked by a tack.

[minsc]

Well, minsc, that's why you don't nerf barefoot! And a tack with a half-centimeter spike isn't going to pierce through a shoe sole. Far less if two-thirds of that spike is covered by foam the foam it's piercing through, if that ever happens.

And also, and I know this isn't my thread, but I thought I said [/question]?

Then fall on one. I hope you are wearing a centimeter thick rubber sheet. Accidents don't have to happen often, just once.

[PC III]

Then fall on one. I hope you are wearing a centimeter thick rubber sheet. Accidents don't have to happen often, just once.

Plus if you shoot one in the back yard-park, and lose it the next kid that comes by and steps on it, or dog that eats it, will be less than pleased.

[s3an967]

I don't know if anyone has said this yet but the colder the weather the shorter range because my LBB usually gets 90- 100 ft flat in summer and about 80- 90 in the winter.

Conclusion- your foam shrinks.

[slowguitarman]

I don't know if anyone has said this yet but the colder the weather the shorter range because my LBB usually gets 90- 100 ft flat in summer and about 80- 90 in the winter.

Conclusion- your foam shrinks.

Good observation, but it's kind of a given. You heat your foam to expand it, and when it cools, it shrinks back down.