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Homemade lvl4 Crossbow

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#126 CaptainSlug

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 01:52 AM

You must have some cheap labor. The easiest steps to outsource are cutting out the labels, applying them, cleaning the edges of the cut parts, and general assembly.
You can get one gun finished and use it to repeat the marking and drilling in steps 9, 10, 11, 12, 15, 17, 21, 25, and 31. Should save about 2 hours per gun.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 08 January 2008 - 01:57 AM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#127 General Cole

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 02:23 AM

80 dollars a gun. To sell. Yeah, we are trying to raise money to build the group armory, and no one wants to pay dues. So we build some +bows, own with them. Then make and sell more. It will be about 6 guys in one machine shop with more tools than oxygen, so yeah, should go fast and cheap when we get good.
We should stop calling out/making fun of/pissing GC off. He's actually contributed and is available for trade. He's a better than average member no doubt. Got your back Cole.
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You know what... I know it's kinda late... but Props Cole.
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#128 VACC

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 09:46 AM

80 dollars a gun. To sell. Yeah, we are trying to raise money to build the group armory, and no one wants to pay dues. So we build some +bows, own with them. Then make and sell more. It will be about 6 guys in one machine shop with more tools than oxygen, so yeah, should go fast and cheap when we get good.



Hehe, your plan makes me chuckle.
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#129 Pineapple

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 10:01 AM

80 dollars a gun. To sell. Yeah, we are trying to raise money to build the group armory, and no one wants to pay dues. So we build some +bows, own with them. Then make and sell more. It will be about 6 guys in one machine shop with more tools than oxygen, so yeah, should go fast and cheap when we get good.


Okay. Whatever you say.
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<!--quoteo(post=209846:date=Feb 5 2009, 06:27 PM:name=boom)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(boom @ Feb 5 2009, 06:27 PM) View Post</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
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#130 CaptainSlug

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 10:41 AM

I'm currently doing research into CNC Routers, which are much more affordable ($3,000 to $6,000 for the models I'm looking at) and will be safer to use with polycarbonate than laser cutting systems would.
I should be able to make more of these some time in the next 6 months. Just have to save up for the tool and get it setup.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 08 January 2008 - 01:19 PM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#131 General Cole

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 12:01 PM

VACC making jokes has me scared. Are you guys serious that you like my plan, or are you just hatin' on my plan? It should work as long as there are buyers. And I don't see start up money being the problem, cause I have about 4 grand lying around from a Halo Suit I sold. So, if anyone wants to put dibs on one, tell me so I don't have to make as many orders from McMaster Carr.
We should stop calling out/making fun of/pissing GC off. He's actually contributed and is available for trade. He's a better than average member no doubt. Got your back Cole.
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You know what... I know it's kinda late... but Props Cole.
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#132 Carbon

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 12:36 PM

VACC making jokes has me scared. Are you guys serious that you like my plan, or are you just hatin' on my plan?

Previous plans to manufacture homemades have never turned out well. People might be more inclined to take you seriously if you had already built one.


And seeing as how I haven't posted in this thread yet...that's some beautiful work, CS. Gotta think and see if I can adapt some of your ideas for my more off-the-shelf kind of work.
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#133 VACC

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Posted 08 January 2008 - 12:43 PM

VACC making jokes has me scared. Are you guys serious that you like my plan, or are you just hatin' on my plan? It should work as long as there are buyers. And I don't see start up money being the problem, cause I have about 4 grand lying around from a Halo Suit I sold. So, if anyone wants to put dibs on one, tell me so I don't have to make as many orders from McMaster Carr.


No, I hope you can produce them. You'll have to expect some scepticism all around I'm afraid, but what I actually found funny was the plan you layed out complete with a bullet point reading "own with them". Pardon my amusement. I'll address any further comments to your new thread, let's leave this one to the Cap'n.

VACC
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#134 Wisey

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 06:46 PM

I think I love you.

I've just had a quick troll though this topic (I'd only read the first two pages before) and I havn't seen much about the intergration rail? Any chance of photos of a gun mounted to it? Or are you planning to make something specific? Or am I a dumbass and missed something here?

Me and Trojan Nerf will be making them when we finish our first batch for ourselves. We will have 3 guys working in assembly line fashion at a machine shop, so, as soon as supplies are bought, we will be fine, I can estimate 80 dollars if I did the math right.

Good luck. You probably going to need it. If CS dosn't make them and you make a good prototype, then put me on your waiting list.

I'm currently doing research into CNC Routers, which are much more affordable ($3,000 to $6,000 for the models I'm looking at) and will be safer to use with polycarbonate than laser cutting systems would.
I should be able to make more of these some time in the next 6 months. Just have to save up for the tool and get it setup.

I think my old secondary (high) school had something similar to this that the used for cutting wood, although I don't really have a clue. Does that basicly mean that with one of these CNC Routers you can (in layman's terms) put in a sheet of polycarbonate and it would cut out all the parts and drill all the holes and make it almost ready for assembly (apart from cutting of the rods for the stock, barrel, plunger tube and anything else not made from polycarbonate). At a comletely random guess this would cut the time to make one down by like 2/3's? Or (it's much more likely that) I'm just talking out talking out of my arse?
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#135 CaptainSlug

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 08:13 PM

1. I haven't seen much about the intergration rail? Any chance of photos of a gun mounted to it? Or are you planning to make something specific? Or am I a dumbass and missed something here?

2. Does that basically mean that with one of these CNC Routers you can (in layman's terms) put in a sheet of polycarbonate and it would cut out all the parts and drill all the holes and make it almost ready for assembly (apart from cutting of the rods for the stock, barrel, plunger tube and anything else not made from polycarbonate). At a completely random guess this would cut the time to make one down by like 2/3's?

1. My collection of guns is extremely small at the moment and I don't have anything I can integrate. I'm either going to have to pick up something I can integrate sometime in the next week, or hand-off that part to someone else so they can tinker with it.
The concept works as far as the bracket is concerned.

2. Yes a CNC Router would allow me to automate the cutting and drilling of parts for multiple guns reducing the per-gun time by atleast 70%. I can create a toolpath code from a CAD drawing and then the router will use that to cut the sheet.
The holes on the edges of some parts would still have to be drilled manually, all of the holes would still have to be tapped manually, and the pieces made from plastic rod will still have to be cut by hand. The time savings is still very significant.
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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#136 jwasko

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 09:10 PM

Firstly, since I haven't said this yet: nice job, CS.

Secondly, a small contribution:

Observing some of your pictures just now, I saw that (like the Crossbow) there is a great place above the plunger chamber to put stuff. I don't know how much you have studied other's Crossbows, but it is fairly common to integrate an AT2(or 3)k, or an SM1500 (maybe an SM3000, too?). When doing this, some people have placed the pump where the Crossbow's barrel originally was (atop the plunger chamber), and the airtank/barrel below the plunger chamber; others do it the opposite way.

So, what I'm trying to say is: a second bracket-attachment point above the plunger chamber would be a great addition and, probably, pretty easy to add to the design.

Edited by jwasko, 09 January 2008 - 09:16 PM.

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#137 Ronster

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 10:53 PM

Do you think it could be possible that you could suppily a kit?
I ahve all the tools and what not to actually make it, it's just getting all the parts that's hard for me.
I'll do all the printing and cutting and assembling...
Just like, the raw, un-cut materials?
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#138 CaptainSlug

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:49 AM

Looks like my cheapest option for a 12x24 size CNC Router is $3,000. But the first thing to address is getting a shed built to house it because it's probably too noisy and messy to use in the house.

So, what I'm trying to say is: a second bracket-attachment point above the plunger chamber would be a great addition and, probably, pretty easy to add to the design.

Yes it will be fairly easy to design a bracket that mounts to the supplied attachment point holes from the outside rather than the inside like the current bracket.

Do you think it could be possible that you could supply a kit?
Just like, the raw, un-cut materials?

When I start making these in bulk it might be feasible for me to supply all of the hardware needed to make the gun and have the only pre-made part included in the kit be a plunger rod. The last items you would have to buy are the 12x12 inch sheets of plastic in 1/4 and 1/8 thicknesses.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 10 January 2008 - 11:16 AM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#139 CaptainSlug

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:32 PM

Turret is finished just in time for Reckoning. Still needs some fine tuning though.
Posted Image
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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#140 jwasko

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:37 PM

This may be a dumb/weird question, but: how did you get those spacer plates on the turret to be so...round?

Did you use a special tool, or are you just that awesome?
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#141 CaptainSlug

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:38 PM

I just used the scrollsaw to follow the printed template. The front plate isn't really round since it has 16 facets.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 10 January 2008 - 07:39 PM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#142 shadowkid33

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:38 PM

You're going to be the toast of the party with that thing on Saturday.

It's mega-intense.
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#143 n-strike

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:39 PM

That's awesome, CS!
kthxbaisend

#144 General Cole

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:59 PM

Could you post up scroll saw patterns for the turret too? That's really cool.
We should stop calling out/making fun of/pissing GC off. He's actually contributed and is available for trade. He's a better than average member no doubt. Got your back Cole.
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You know what... I know it's kinda late... but Props Cole.
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#145 Cmdrmack

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 08:12 PM

This thing might be the more fearsome nerf blaster I've seen. I know it's not unbeatable, but it looks like it should be. I look forward to seeing it in action sometime.
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#146 Blasphemy

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 08:19 PM

Turret is finished just in time for Reckoning. Still needs some fine tuning though.
Posted Image


Just wow. Alright, I'll be compiling a list of people who are willing to pay for "I Less Than Three CaptainSlug" t-shirts.

Seriously CS that is awesome, is that PETG just 12" long? Also, how well does that PETG fit into your adapter/coupler?
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#147 CaptainSlug

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 08:47 PM

Could you post up scroll saw patterns for the turret too? That's really cool.

I'll post them once the turret has all the kinks worked out. Among other things the tooth piece that creates the ratcheting mechanism needs to be redesigned. Right now it's rotating when it should be sliding.

Seriously CS that is awesome, is that PETG just 12" long? Also, how well does that PETG fit into your adapter/coupler?

The turret has 10-inch barrels so I can see if there is a performance difference between these and 12 inches. The turret isn't designed for any specific barrel length though.
There's a short CPVC stub in the hex bushing that then bolts to the backplate of the turret.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 10 January 2008 - 09:35 PM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?

#148 Diablo

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 03:33 AM

Homemades have come such a long way since I first joined the NIC.

Fantastic job on this, CaptainSlug. I really like how you took the time to write up a fully complete tutorial also. I read it from start to finish and it's very easy to comprehend. I have all the tools at my disposal to build one of these, so perhaps I'll look into doing so one day.

Amazing job once again, and I hope that if you plan on selling these you'll have enough buyers to merit your effort.
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#149 frost vectron

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 03:47 AM

Bravo, Captain Slug!

Your work never fails to amaze me. That turreted +Bow looks incredible! I'd love to see a side-by-side shot with FA_24's Doomsayer.

I think you did a great job capturing the essense of the original Crossbow and adding to it. I read through the instruction guide, and I must say that this gun is built to survive! The entire thing must be incredibly robust!

Again, great job!
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#150 CaptainSlug

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Posted 13 January 2008 - 09:40 AM

Testing experience at Reckoning was very informative. Overall performance of the +Bow was excellent and the gun is very accurate and has a very effective reach.
The one problem I had was screws creeping themselves loose. I will fix this on my gun by switching to screws with nested lock washers, and will update the part list to reflect that change.
And the plunger handle is only really durable if there is one on each side of the plunger rod, so I will update the cutting template sheet as well.

Turret
Pros
+ Very high rate of fire
Cons
- Needs quite a few design adjustments to improve functionality
- Takes a long time to reload 8 barrels, even from the rear of the turret
- Heavy
- Slightly reduced range
- Makes the gun a larger target
Verdict
= Will have to be redesigned

Plastic Slide Breech
Pros
+ VERY Lightweight
+ Fairly high and consistent rate of fire
+ Optimal range
Cons
- Plunger HAS to be primed before the breech is reloaded or the plunger travel will shift the dart forward by 2 inches.
Verdict
= My personal favorite

Posted Image
Oh yeah. And I added some padding to the stock Thursday night.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 06 February 2008 - 12:12 PM.

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The little critters of nature, they don't know that they're ugly. That's very funny, a fly marrying a bumble bee. I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me. Why didn't you believe me?


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