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Sledgehammer

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#26 Chessler

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 11:33 AM

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Sort of reminds me of the Gattlin' Storm.

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#27 davenelz

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 02:36 PM

That thing is sheer intensity.

Personally, I wouldn't want to see it aimed at my head.
Great illustrative work, looks clean.
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#28 CaptainSlug

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 03:21 PM

Awesome designs, my only concern is that, that design looks extremely front heavy making it rather hard to aim well, run with, etc. (kind of like a minigun?). Anyway I'll enjoy seeing the finished product.

Of course. It should be much lighter than a PVC homemade since PETG weighs less per square inch. And the option of switching to two-handed firing should help with the balance of the weapon. Keep in mind that the outer diameter of the ammo drum is only 6 inches and the barrel lengths are are meager 5 inches.
It's not really designed for accuracy since that would require a longer barrel.

Just out of curiosity, how long does it take you to draw up those desings?  I'm in an engineering acadamy at my highschool using inventor and if I was to make those it would take days but you seem to push em' out almost immidietly!

Depends on how detailed my mental image of the design is. They take anywhere from 4 to 15 hours. I'm fast only because I have around 10 years of practice in various forms of 3D modelling. Understanding the materials and tools related to the design also makes the process much faster.

Sort of reminds me of the Gattlin' Storm.

Thankfully mine won't be a manual pump-to-fire.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 16 March 2006 - 03:34 PM.

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#29 Meaker VI

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 05:38 PM

Good grief, I go on spring break, come back, and all sorts of new designs are released. This latest design looks pretty good, but it does kinda have that mini-gun look to it. Maybe a mini-gun combined with a machine pistol... (Shudders at the thought of having one pointed at me)

Keep up the good work, I'd really like to see one of these clean designs come out from the computer into physical form.
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#30 Denaeron 12

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 06:13 PM

I would suggest adding a strut that goes through the mag and has a pump handle on it, similar to the new SCAR-N's system. That would balance out the weight of the gun and make it a little more convenient for close combat.

Looks awsome though.

Edit: I would buy one or two of these if you made several.

Edited by Denaeron_12, 20 March 2006 - 06:13 PM.

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#31 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 07:12 PM

I would suggest adding a strut that goes through the mag and has a pump handle on it, similar to the new SCAR-N's system. That would balance out the weight of the gun and make it a little more convenient for close combat.

A pump handle as a grip or a pump handle to prime/advance? Either one should be simple to ad, but might only be usable if the stock were folded.
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#32 Denaeron 12

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 07:19 PM

Just make it so you can use it without the pump handle, so that it can be used with a stock and without.
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#33 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 07:22 PM

Oh, well the design as-is now can be setup in two modes. One where the grip is the priming handle (allowing for prime-and-fire with only one arm) and the other with the stock folded and the side plates changed out so that the grip is stationary and the handles on the side are used for priming. I do however see now that a fore-grip would be more ergonomic as a priming handle so I may ditch the side handles so all that needs to be removed is a pair of plates that lock the grip to the priming action.

I'm also considering a removable barrel attachment for the front that would improve accuracy.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 20 March 2006 - 07:24 PM.

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#34 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 09:02 PM

Here we go. Now all you have to do to lock the grip/trigger so that it's not used to advance/prime is simply move 4 thumbscrews. The added foregrip provides stability when the weapon is held with two hands and the stock is folded onto the top of the gun (or removed).
Posted Image
Posted Image
The removable barrel attaches to the foregrip with 3 thumbscrews and also acts as a clamp seal to hold the drum tightly when the weapon is ready to fire. It will improve accuracy, but will prevent the drum from being able to load stock darts. Therefore it is optional.

Having the removable barrel also allowed me to shorten the length of the drum.

The drum can't be easily ejected with the barrel in place so that seems to be another disadvantage of having it. I'm not sure how to fix that at the moment.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 20 March 2006 - 09:11 PM.

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#35 Denaeron 12

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 09:06 PM

Good to see I could be of help.
If you can build this, you are going to be on level with Bolt's SCAR-N.
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#36 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 09:40 PM

I think I've fixed the drum ejection problem.
Posted Image
I widened the clip retention rollers, moved the advancing tooth back a little bit to get it out of the way, and I added a tooth to the underside of the clip eject part so that it pushes the foregrip and barrel forward a little bit. Now the drum is much easier to remove whether the barrel is in place or not.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 20 March 2006 - 09:40 PM.

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#37 Denaeron 12

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 09:45 PM

Wow, you can tell how easy it is to remove the clip from a rendering?
:ph34r:
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#38 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 09:52 PM

Wow, you can tell how easy it is to remove the clip from a rendering?
:P

Yeah, I've been doing this kind of thing too long. :ph34r:

In effect you will point the gun at the ground, press the clip-eject all the way down with your right hand which will advance the foregrip and barrel 1/4-inch". The drum will drop forward and can be pushed towards the top of the gun a little (either with your left hand or your leg) and it will fall to the ground as it passes over the barrel and foregrip.
Without the barrel attached you should be able to simply dump the drum in the same manner with only one hand used to hold down the clip eject.

It should also be fairly easy to design a straight clip to fit in the same mechanism that's meant to hold the drum.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 20 March 2006 - 09:55 PM.

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#39 Denaeron 12

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 10:48 PM

I surrender to your superior design skills!!!
:P

A straight clip would be a good idea, it would probably be easier to carry several into battle.
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#40 CaptainSlug

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Posted 20 March 2006 - 11:00 PM

Indeed, but I'm still thinking it's an odd trade-off since the only thing I would gain by going to a straight clip is reducing the weigh of the gun. Do you want 20 rounds loaded at a time, or 8 loaded and the rest in three spare clips?

The potential is there, but to make it as good as I want it to be I'll have to find a way to integrate a feed system similar to what was on the sledgehammer.
I'll have to take some time to figure that out.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 20 March 2006 - 11:01 PM.

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#41 CaptainSlug

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Posted 21 March 2006 - 07:08 PM

Huzzah!
Posted Image
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Minor edits on the clip retention system were needed to allow the acceptance of both a drum magazine and a straight clip magazine. The changes made will allow a 10-round straight clip magazine to be used in place of the drum.
The straight clip is also extremely easy to feed into the gun, carry on hook straps, and eject by holding down the button and tippin the gun to either side.

Now it kind of looks like a STEN...

Edited by CaptainSlug, 21 March 2006 - 07:16 PM.

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#42 CaptainSlug

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Posted 23 March 2006 - 03:00 AM

It's going to take some time but I'm working on a template sheet for all of the parts so that I can use label paper as a direct cutting template. This will also allow me to accurately estimate exactly how many sheets of plastic I need. I probably already have more than enough polycarbonate in my scrap pile to make this so the only thing I would need to order is the spring and some O-rings.

So I'll be back with a full materials and costs estimate list in a few days. I have another project taking priority at the moment and I'd like to make some progress on it before getting distracted by this.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 23 March 2006 - 03:02 AM.

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#43 Falcon

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Posted 23 March 2006 - 11:17 AM

I've really enjoyed reading through this. Looks like you're reall thought this stuff through.

On the most recent addition, allowig both straight and drum clip acceptance:

You might want to be sure that there's something to hold the straight clips horizontal relative to the gun. Otherwise, they'll get pulled down, and will be hanging at an angle. If you put in any sort of brace to hold them hrizontal, just make sure it's on the top, because putting a straight brace underneath the clip would render the drum clips unuseable. So if you could put some sort of track on top of the gun that could flip up and out of the way for removal of either clip style (sort of like on the variation of the RF20 removable turret mod that I have on my page, with the shell piece duct taped into a hinge).

Just trying to make sure you have ALL of your bases covered.

On the first page of this thread, I particularly like your concept for the springer with the plunger that is alongside the barrel which you cock by pushing the handle forward. It's very simple, and it looks like it's a good length to use an xbow's plunger system without the large handlke @ the back of the plunger. But that would make for a helluva fat plunger casing.

So...you might refer to the research done on making bycicle hand pumps into spring plungers. If you could pull that off with a 1.5 foot or so bike pump, I think you'd be well on your way.

Love the designs. I've said before in a number of places, I'm no user of homemades, and I'm not the biggest fan of them, but people like you, bolt,a nd 3DBBQ at least keep me checking the homemades forums...

Keep it up!
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#44 Denaeron 12

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Posted 23 March 2006 - 03:54 PM

Yes, make sure you have a support for the clip...
Yet another magazine idea:
How easy would it be to make the feeding mechanism accept ammo belts? The RoF would be the same of course, but you could hold much more ammunition, and it would be easier to carry more around as well.

On another note, do you have plans to build and sell these? You could make a fair amount if you only advertised here (Nerf Haven) and at Nerf HQ.
I would certainly buy one of these if it costs less than $50 or so.
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#45 CaptainSlug

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Posted 23 March 2006 - 09:42 PM

The clip is held from the underside by two retention rollers and one on the top. It's not going to go anywhere provided the eject button is clamped shut with enough force by the spring. The rollers work more effectively than a simple track and provided they're spaced correctly they can hold a drum or a straight clip.

A belt system would be rather difficult to make reliable. I'm working on a different design at the moment that uses a huge "gravity clip". I don't really want to release that design yet because that would be "teasing" since I REALLY don't have time to make it right now.

And I don't have plans to make this design in mass quantities, unless it proves dreadfully simple to make. Material costs are quire low since it was designed to be made out of scrap plastic that I can buy for a few dollars per pound.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 23 March 2006 - 10:40 PM.

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#46 CaptainSlug

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Posted 24 March 2006 - 12:12 AM

Final version that has alot of small revisions. Mainly I needed to change the size of the plunger tank, which allowed me to change some things I wanted to previously but couldn't.
Posted Image

Edited by CaptainSlug, 24 March 2006 - 12:14 AM.

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#47 CaptainSlug

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Posted 24 March 2006 - 08:52 PM

Oh, I forgot to ask but which would be prefered as ammo. Mega stefans or micro stefans? PETG Polyester tubing comes in exacting sizes for both and the way this gun was designed it could shoot either depending on which ID of tubing I use.
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#48 Greek Assassin

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Posted 24 March 2006 - 09:22 PM

I find micros to have more range, but megas to be more accurate, but thats just what I've seen with my darts.
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#49 Maverick Master

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Posted 25 March 2006 - 10:48 AM

I would say go with micros. In my experince they go farther and are more accurate.
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#50 Meaker VI

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 02:30 PM

Most people use micros. If you wanted, you could probably build it to accept both with different clips (judging from your plan), but I'd say go with micros.
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