134 replies to this topic

[Chanclas]

I really like the newest look. Great job. Glad I posted this and glad I inspired such an impressive design. VERY glad that I could inspire you, CaptainSlug. My baby is growing so fast.

 

Suggestions:

1) A bit of rubber on the front of the shuttle plate or on the slide or both to dampen impact. A small thing but just maybe could prevent a cracked slide or shuttle. Maybe not, you probably already thought of something like this.

2) My magazines and handles are SUPER easy to make, no need to print them. And you already know how to protect yourself from the plastic fumes.

 

Questions:

1) Are you making your own magazine springs? Or have you figured out how to fit constant force springs in there? Hmm, maybe longways instead of sideways, like Boltsniper did in the FAR. I should have tried that.

2) You choose a new name?

3) Can I have first dibs when you print this thing out and sell it?

 

I wish I had more free time, I would DEFINITELY be trying to build this the old fashioned way right now with my Dremel and pipe.

 

Do another one, CaptainSlug! Surprise me again.

[CaptainSlug]

S1) If anything will get beat up it would probably be the shuttle itself. I'm probably going to make most of the prototype out of PVC rather than printing it. The only part particularly ideal for printing is the piece that has the air-redirecting pathway inside of it.

S2) I have to make a forming spike, but I do have an oven in the back of work I can use for softening pipe.

 

1) I bought some music wire and an artifact magazine to play with. I'll see if I can duplicate the spring that comes with that magazine. I have a ton of practice bending wire, but not for the purpose of making a spring. Failing that a constant-force spring or two might work if they can be added without making the magazine too much deeper.

2) Not yet.

3) Yes.

[jwasko]

You may have already seen this, Slug, but there was a design posted on reddit for a magazine that used a rubber band: https://www.reddit.c...ed_stefan_mags/

 

It is made to use with stefans in a standard size magwell, so it won't fit in a pistol grip. But it might be something to consider.

[Meaker VI]

You may have already seen this, Slug, but there was a design posted on reddit for a magazine that used a rubber band: https://www.reddit.c...ed_stefan_mags/

 

It is made to use with stefans in a standard size magwell, so it won't fit in a pistol grip. But it might be something to consider.

Was just going to suggest the same thing. Elastic/rubber bands may be a better option with the difficulty in making springs, and should take up less space in the magwell.

[Geric2004]

Can this help? https://www.jetblast...atana-magazines

It's a stefan magazine.

Edited by Geric2004, 05 April 2017 - 07:26 AM.

[CaptainSlug]

The feed angle on those will be wrong for use in a grip. Unless you're fine with a completely vertical grip like an Uzi has.

 

They also don't exist yet and Jet has not been the most reliable company when it comes to delivering products in a reasonable amount of time.

[Eightdotno]

I would love to commission one of these, but instead of slugs it fires elites because of the rules at the wars I go to, but I know that I would easily mess up my darts.

[Geric2004]

I would love to commission one of these, but instead of slugs it fires elites because of the rules at the wars I go to, but I know that I would easily mess up my darts.

 

I don't think the design would be able to fire regular elites. The design is made for slugs and stefans.

[Eightdotno]

 
I don't think the design would be able to fire regular elites. The design is made for slugs and stefans.

That's kind of what I said...

[CaptainSlug]

That's kind of what I said...

Unless you have enormous basketball player hands, a full-length dart magazine would make a terrible grip. This design will only work with 1-1/2" length or shorter darts.

[blitz]

You may have already seen this, Slug, but there was a design posted on reddit for a magazine that used a rubber band: https://www.reddit.c...ed_stefan_mags/

 

It is made to use with stefans in a standard size magwell, so it won't fit in a pistol grip. But it might be something to consider.

 

Somewhat unrelated: I downloaded the files before he took it down (I have no idea why he did that, but whatever). They're mesh-y .stl format which makes them nigh-impossible to edit, but I can send them to whoever wants them if need be. 

[Silly]

I feel really stupid, but this DOES shoot stefans as the ammo, right?

[Meaker VI]

 

Somewhat unrelated: I downloaded the files before he took it down (I have no idea why he did that, but whatever). They're mesh-y .stl format which makes them nigh-impossible to edit, but I can send them to whoever wants them if need be. 

 

I did the same, and since it was originally posted with a CC-BY license, have rehosted them here in our digital design directory just a few posts up.

[blitz]

 

I did the same, and since it was originally posted with a CC-BY license, have rehosted them here in our digital design directory just a few posts up.

 

Oh sweet, I didn't see that. Thanks Meaker!

[Geric2004]

I'll just leave these here:

https://www.reddit.c...ndle_semi_auto/

 

https://www.dropbox....AG0509.jpg?dl=0

[jwasko]

I'll just leave these here:

https://www.reddit.c...ndle_semi_auto/

 

https://www.dropbox....AG0509.jpg?dl=0

Yes, that's a great design. But aside from the magazine in the grip it's fairly completely different from what we are working on here.

[Eightdotno]

Unless you have enormous basketball player hands, a full-length dart magazine would make a terrible grip. This design will only work with 1-1/2" length or shorter darts.

I do have enormous hands, so would it work?

[Meaker VI]

I do have enormous hands, so would it work?

Wrap your hand around a standard mag now and try to imagine pulling a trigger with it like that. If that works for you, then yeah it could maybe work.

[Speedr117]

Wrap your hand around a standard mag now and try to imagine pulling a trigger with it like that. If that works for you, then yeah it could maybe work.

Add the part for the magwell too.
But seriously, you could use this design with shredder rounds.(elites cut in half). Would that work.
Also how much would said commission cost. I'm just looking for a ballpark. I will probably only use blasters I make myself, even if they are inferior.

Edited by Speedr117, 07 April 2017 - 02:01 PM.

[CaptainSlug]

I just did some basic tests with trying to reshape PVC today. I used an oven at work at temperature intervals to find the minimum and maximum for softening PVC. I cut four 10-inch lengths of 1" thin wall pipe. I also previously made a wooden spike to use for forcing the pipe into the rectangular inner dimensions I want to get to. 250F seemed to be the minimum, but the parts would cool down really fast once they were taken out of the oven.

 

I settled on 350F being the overall best temperature for softening the PVC in that it gave a few seconds to try and stretch it before it cooled off too much. I didn't want to end up going too far beyond 400F as I was concerned about getting too close to a liquid state with it.

 

Even at this temperature point the PVC has limited ability to be stretched. And as such the 1" thin wall PVC was not managing to stretch to my target dimensions. Chanclas was aiming for a much smaller target dimension than I'm trying to reach so after a dozen or so failed attempts (with the same four lengths) I decided I would simply have to move up to the next size of thin wall pipe in order to have more circumference to work with. So I bought some of that and will have to try expanding/reshaping it tomorrow or Monday.

 

The other surprise I had was that there was no smell. I've gotten used to how awful Type I PVC smells when you overheat it. Whatever this grade of PVC is it doesn't produce as many byproduct vapors as Type I. At least not at the temperatures I was going to.

 

The end result is that yes, making oblong tubing is quite easy. You just can't go too far beyond the original inner circumference of the pipe when you buy it. The shape you get is easy enough to change, and you do need to have a mold or form that has an ample coating of mold release or lubricant on it or your cooled piece is going to be very difficult to get off.

 

Once the right pipe size and form are chosen, making these in batches should be pretty easy.

 

shredder rounds.(elites cut in half). Would that work.

It should work with any dart cut down to 1-1/2" length.

[CaptainSlug]

RESULTS! 1-1/4 pipe was not working and what I discovered this morning is that if you get the PVC to the right temperature it both flattens out completely, and it seems to shrink in length.

Tools

+ Hammer

+ Long 1/2" dowel

+ Bench vice

+ Oven

+ MIG welding gloves or Oven mits

+ Bucket of water

+ Clothing iron or a big slab of steel

+ Sheet of plywood

+ Oscillating fan

+ Cookie Sheet

+ Aluminum Foil

 

Recipe

0. Make a wood spike that has the internal dimensions you want your magazine to have, setup a chair near the side of the oven with a fan blowing towards the oven from behind where you will sit

1. Set oven to 400 degrees F and let it preheat

2. Turn on range hood to HIGH

3. Cut 10-inch lengths of 1" thin wall PVC

4. Stick those lengths on a tray lined with aluminum foil and put it in the oven. Wait 10 minutes until the pipe lengths have flattened themselves

6. WHILE WEARING AN OVEN MITT OR GLOVE ON EACH HAND: Pull one length of PVC out of the oven

7. Shove the now noodly length of HOT PVC onto your spike until it's bottomed out at the flat end.

8. Lay this down on the sheet of plywood and set the iron/steel block onto its wider side and run it across it a few times to remove any wrinkles.

9. Let the iron/steel block sit on it for 30 seconds to cool.

10. Stick a paper towel in your bucket of water and then rub water onto your PVC part to cool it the rest of the way.

11. Take your spike-and-pipe into a bench vice jaws that are open enough for the spike to fit through. Rest the PVC against the jaws.

12. Use your dowel and a hammer to push the spike out of the PVC.

 

Now you have a blank for a PVC mag wall (or grip for it to fit inside of) that will have to be cut at the ends to get rid of the the ripples and the edges you beat up trying to get the spike out of it.

 

Now that I have three blanks I can finish the design and then make some parts.

[Geric2004]

RESULTS! 1-1/4 pipe was not working and what I discovered this morning is that if you get the PVC to the right temperature it both flattens out completely, and it seems to shrink in length.

Would a 3d printed version work as well? Also, why ot cut it out of PC Sheets and then just curve the front with pvc. Since the back of the dart is flat and only the front is relatively curved.

[CaptainSlug]

1. Probably. But wouldn't be as cheap/fast. Once you have the form, You can crank out 10 magazine bodies from one 8-foot length of thin wall pipe. This really takes no time at all to do once I figured out HOW to do it in a way that's repeatable. More time is spent waiting for the PVC to reach temperature than I spend putting it on the spike, then getting it back off. It would be really easy to crank out a dozen of these in a weekend.

2. Time, complexity, and size. I'm making the magazine body and feed lips from one part as opposed to two, three, or four parts. And the blank I end up with weighs nothing since it's .080" thick walls. The length of these blanks is also somewhat variable, so I can choose capacity later if I want to.

 

I have some practice with bending polycarbonate. And you can't make two bends close enough together in a pan-and-brake to make a mag well that way.

 

The next step (after some design work) is to make a template or even a cutting jig so that I can drill the holes and cut out the feed lips identically between blanks. I have to decide on how I want to do the magazine catch first before committing to making a jig.

 

What follows after that is winding my own springs.

[Meaker VI]

 What follows after that is winding my own springs.

Rubber bands...

[Draconis]

The other surprise I had was that there was no smell. I've gotten used to how awful Type I PVC smells when you overheat it. Whatever this grade of PVC is it doesn't produce as many byproduct vapors as Type I. At least not at the temperatures I was going to.

 

 

Something I found out recently is that the vapors we always thought were chlorine gas (for the kids at home: super death, Geneva Convention illegal, melt your lungs stuff), is actually HCl (hydrochloric acid).  While still not something you want massive exposure to, it isn't going to kill you, mutate your dog, or anything like that.