370 replies to this topic

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

The tip is a nail, the body is a cut-down tube from a Bic pen (with hole cut in black end cap), the two springs are from some spare pens, and the springs are threaded onto a second nail. The heads of the nails are touching, and the blue cap is the cut-down base from a blue wall anchor (like the kind used for nails) with the side tabs, base rim, and fluted tip removed.

What's there pretty much explains everything. What it is is a pen tube from a Bic pen with a hole drilled in the black end cap for the tip of a nail, then two nails placed with their heads touching were dropped into the tube so that the shaft of one nail protruded completely from the cap. Springs were threaded onto the second nail (the one not protruding from the cap), and a nail wall anchor was cut down and used as a cap for the back so that the shaft of the second nail could protrude from the wall anchor when the first nail was forced back into the pen tube by a shell.

I have since put the idea aside in hopes that a simple nail and spring put in between the layers of the bolt will be enough to eject the shells. If I can test this new "design," I will post the results and how effective of a system it is.

[Commonly Hunted]

This topic is not dead.

I have found the perfect spring for the magtube. It is from Home Depot and is from Handyman like the NF springs. It compresses to one inch from about 3 3/4" and is strong enough to push the shells through the tube. Right now I have four springs and want to get another pack because I think 5 will fit better.

I was going to compare the spring with the NF spring but they're in guns right now.
Spring:


With these springs I can fit 6 shells in the tube.
Springs to Magtube:


Spring package (SP-9711):


12" body:



Barrel shell:



Barrel, body, and magtube (with slide):


I plan on adding a section of 1 1/4" PVC around the slide.


Sketch I've been promising

I don't know the exact price of the springs but they must be cheaper than the NF springs and they also come in packs of two.

And to those buying homemades from me, thsoe are on temporary hold until I finish this because this is my science project. Analysis data is due March 15 so I should be working on the homemades again around that time.

[sam]

How big is this thing going to be? It looks huge.

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

How big is this thing going to be? It looks huge.

I don't know about CH, but my shotty (I am beginning the final design phase now) is only intended to be slightly larger than a Longshot (without barrel extension and with extended stock).

Also, glad to see that the topic is still alive.

[Commonly Hunted]

I don't know how big it will be exactly because I haven't made the stock which will be fitted to my arm length. But it already is about 30" I think. 12" body and long barrel. If I knew the exact measurements of a real shotgun I'd change things but the design was made while looking at a picture of one.

But I don't care how big it is, it only has to work well to gain my respeK!

[Ronster]

Looks like you've got yourself a new camera there, Common. Sweet!

Why did you make the barrel so long though?

[Commonly Hunted]

No new camera. I guess I'm getting better with taking pictures except some of those are still blurry.

The barrel shell is cosmetically long. The actual barrel inside that shell will be cut down to the appropriate length during testing. I just finished the barrel but it is as long as the shell which is 20" for now.

The stock will also be kind of long but I think that it won't matter much when in a war because I'd hold it between my side and my arm instead against my shoulder. I got most of the pieces cut but I don't have enough 1 1/4" PVC to finish it just yet. And I'd have to find the length that will fit well and look right.

Of course, I will be making anything that can be smaller smaller.

The slide with 1 1/4" PVC over 1" thin-wall is kind of fat so I added another section of 1" thin-wall around the first one and it feels better and I won't have to glue it but I might.

And could anyone see the link to my sketch? Just wondering if it is set to private or not.

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

Of course, I will be making anything that can be smaller smaller.

A couple tips for anyone building a shotty:

1) Having a lot of shells in the magazine is great, but don't forget that each additional shell increases the required length of the spring, tube, and overall gun.
2) Housing the plunger within the stock can drastically reduce the length of the gun.
3)Barrel length needs to be tested for the optimal length, depending on your ammo dimensions and power of your plunger.

Also, if anyone has figured the kinks out of the pump-action system, then I would like to know what you did so I can switch back to my original pump-action design. (I.e.: how do you keep the rotating head from turning too soon and not locking with the back of the barrel.)

[Meaker VI]

Huzzah! It's still alive!

CH, if you haven't already figured out how to attach the pump to the bolt, I'd recommend using epoxy putty and screws, I built mine that way and it's solid as a rock. I'd love to see how you're getting the shells loaded, since that is where I'm stuck right now (and going to stay stuck until summer, I'm not going to have time over spring break).

SHA, I have no idea how to solve a rotating bolt issue, though I'd assume you could just use Bolt's design in the shotgun shell. Really all that would need to be different is the loading mechanism (Again, where I'm having trouble. It would probably work if I switched to a clip shotgun.).

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

SHA, I have no idea how to solve a rotating bolt issue, though I'd assume you could just use Bolt's design in the shotgun shell. Really all that would need to be different is the loading mechanism (Again, where I'm having trouble. It would probably work if I switched to a clip shotgun.).

Since nobody currently knows the answer to this problem, my Mk. 1 variant will be bolt-action. If it is successful and I figure out the answer to this question, then I will make a pump-action Mk. 2 variant.

[Jergling]

Is your shotgun going to fire off multiple darts? Or is it just going to work like a shotgun?

Even though I'm a noob here, I'm a gamer, and this is really irritating to me too, you people need to understand that shotguns fire SHOT, which is a bunch of projectiles at once, please try to understand that.

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

Even though I'm a noob here, I'm a gamer, and this is really irritating to me too, you people need to understand that shotguns fire SHOT, which is a bunch of projectiles at once, please try to understand that.

Nobody asked you to be a jackass and give a lecture on what to call our homemades, Jergling. I am aware of what a shotgun is, having fired several before. However, the design and operation are identical to that of a shotgun, and that's what I'm going to call it. Unless you have a contribution to make that will help these guns get built, please do not respond in my thread again to make room for other developments.

Edited by SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA, 26 February 2007 - 06:58 PM.

[LastManAlive]

I've just started the 3D design of what I plan to make. With school and other occurences going on, I haven't had time to even fathom a thought of the shotgun much less get my current small porjects complete. All I have so far, and with it being a good start really, is the barrel. I have made a set choice on barrel material being 9/16ths or 17/32nds brass nessed in 1/2 inch PVC. The PVC actually was added instead of using a smaller walled material I had found. The previous material was a thinner walled tubing, and after thinking about it over more, I decided that the breech would work better with something that was thicker and allowed more material to work with to make sure I don't cut darts when the breech closes. But it adds a new problem of having more than one dart into the barrel. That was avoided by making the breech twice as long (allowing 2 darts to fit into the PVC breech) as the brass breech (only long enough for 1 dart). The brech itself will most likely be another peice of PVC that just closes the brass breech, but leaves half of the PVC breech open. I will just make sure to take pics as I go along.

Until then, I will have even more practice with CADD while I train for a SkillsUSA competition in Mechanical Drafting and this will make my design come together faster as my 3D abilities are just developing right now on AutoCAD. If I get a good enough version of AutoCAD I will be able to work on the design more and even maybe get an animation out with a finished version and a detailed version. That's a hop, skip, and jump down the road though right now. On top of that, I have to see why our robot on the Toyota Robotics Competition goes backwards and starts spinning when we clap. I have a feeling someone tampered with it, but just another flaw to work out.

EDIT: So jergling, that's all a shotgun shoots? Oh wait, maybe in a video game. Get up off your fat ass from a console and go learn something like the fact that shotguns also fire slugs. Hollow, round, and quite large and meaty projectiles instead of aobut 200 tiny ones. They can do some mean damage.

Edited by LastManAlive, 27 February 2007 - 07:58 PM.

[Grenado]

Even though I'm a noob here, I'm a gamer, and this is really irritating to me too, you people need to understand that shotguns fire SHOT, which is a bunch of projectiles at once, please try to understand that.

Nobody asked you to be a jackass and give a lecture on what to call our homemades, Jergling. I am aware of what a shotgun is, having fired several before. However, the design and operation are identical to that of a shotgun, and that's what I'm going to call it. Unless you have a contribution to make that will help these guns get built, please do not respond in my thread again to make room for other developments.

HEAR HEAR. He was an asshat and a baby. Do you think PETG might work as barrel material?

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

HEAR HEAR. He was an asshat and a baby. Do you think PETG might work as barrel material?

Possibly, but I would stick with brass. It has been proven in boltsniper's guns, and since my shotty is based heavily on boltsniper systems, I would personally only trust brass. PETG can be tricky to house because of the difference in ID and OD, while brass is thin, strong, and easily housed.

[Commonly Hunted]

Yeah, I'm going to be using brass now because I can't think of any other way of making the bolt like Boltsniper's without the same material. I might even add the rotating bolt.

But now I have to buy some 1/2" PVC (thin-wall or not, I don't know) to put in the magtube because the shells are lot smaller than I thought would be. I am also hoping that I can make it so that you could switch out the barrel, bolt, and magtube to use different shells because I really like how easy it was to make my PVC shells.

And does any one of you have the picture that Bolt put up for his SCAR shells? I need that diagram to make my own.

Maybe I'll post pics of my bolt so far later. Man, it looks so much smaller than you'd think after seeing the SCAR-N bolt.
...

Here they are.

The brass bolt.



Again in some 1/2" PVC


The unfinished stock.

The diagonal piece will cross over the horizontal pieces like in my sketch so it won't look as long as it does now. Forgot to put a ruler next to it.

The barrel.

Will be changed to 12" of 17/32" brass now because I have it and then the rest might be 9/16" brass.

The feed hole in the bottom of the top section of the body.

It was made to fit my 1/2" PVC shells.

The feed system.


I haven't glued any of the brass together because it might need touching up and I don't even have super glue. The barrel isn't glued either because I knew I was going to be reshaping and adjusting the spacers on it. The feed ramp and magtube are not finalized since the shells will be much smaller. I haven't made any of the rest of the bolt (the 1/2" PVC in the third bolt picture is not part of it, just for size comparison) and won't until I get some super glue and better dimensions.

Questions? Suggestions?

Edited by Commonly Hunted, 28 February 2007 - 02:57 PM.

[Meaker VI]

How is your feed tube working? Because just forcing the shells up the ramp would only work if they get stuck in something at the end of the ramp and can straighten out (other wise it'll just get pushed back down the ramp by the bolt, and then flipped over and you're all messed up then), and you'll need the shells to not touch each other when feeding, otherwise the same thing might happen except with the shell in the bolt flipping the shell in the mag. Although I suppose you could do it so that two shells wouldn't cause problems like that...

And for that "j" guy or whatever, as far as I know all these systems are using shells, thus allowing for "shot" or slugs or pellets or rocks, etc. to be fired.

[LastManAlive]

HEAR HEAR. He was an asshat and a baby. Do you think PETG might work as barrel material?

Possibly, but I would stick with brass. It has been proven in boltsniper's guns, and since my shotty is based heavily on boltsniper systems, I would personally only trust brass. PETG can be tricky to house because of the difference in ID and OD, while brass is thin, strong, and easily housed.

I am using brass for the barrel, but I was going to use PETG for the outer barrel. Then I fell upon the problem of not having enough material to work with and went with PVC. I figure that if the magwell, or in this case the dart tube, will be 1/2inch PVC and the breech will go through that first, I would have the barrel (brass) nested in 1/2 PVC as well. The breech will continue from the 'magwell' to the barrel housing, into the barrel. And as it does this (and with it being toploaded) there will be a steady distance for darts in this cycle and will allow you to load more darts without damaging the ones already inside the magwell when you press the triangular peice of material down to allow you to shove more darts in. If anyone has seen the shotty design by Zero Talent, you can basically take that, put the magwell ontop, give it a clothespin trigger, and make it look like the shotgun out of Halo, and you will have what I am designing.

EDIT: This is a crude, 10 minutes paintjob but if you really try to follow it, you MIGHT get the idea. I don't have a good version of CAD at home for me to use or else I would pull up what I have so far and get a pic on here. Sorry.

http://i18.photobuck...Crap_Shotty.jpg

Edited by LastManAlive, 28 February 2007 - 09:32 PM.

[Commonly Hunted]

Hope you can understand this:


The bolt will be extended and bend into the magtube to act as the thing that will stop the shells from popping out of the tube while loading. If I can't make it as part of the bolt, I will attach wire or something.

There will only be space on the front part of the bolt for one shell, the next shell will be forced back by the restrictor claw into the magtube.

But I haven't made this so I don't know if it'll work yet.

[Ronster]

How do you plan to eject the shells from the bolt???
You have the extractor, but I can't see the ejector...

[Commonly Hunted]

Forgot to mention that I didn't have the ejector yet. I think I'll make that after gluing the brass layers together to get a consistently sized ejector. And I need to know how Boltsniper put the spring in his because there isn't much space to do it they way I did in the FAR.

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

And I need to know how Boltsniper put the spring in his because there isn't much space to do it they way I did in the FAR.

I was just going to make a hollow spot opposite the extractor where I could lock in the spring and base of the ejector, and cover that with another layer of PVC.

[Commonly Hunted]

Could you make a sketch to better explain? I kind of don't get it.

And I found another spring that you guys could use for the magtube. No pictures or measurements but I can explain it. It is the spring that is in the tube that holds your toilet paper next to your toilet. It might be a little strong but you could probably fix that somehow. I think they are about 3 to 4 inches long and maybe 3/4 inch wide. Not sure.

Edited by Commonly Hunted, 04 March 2007 - 06:07 PM.

[SHADOW HUNTER ALPHA]

Could you make a sketch to better explain? I kind of don't get it.

I may be able to soon, but right now my scanner doesn't work, and the paint program on my computer is on the fritz.

==============================|
==================________________|
==============================|
==============================|
Side
--_______
-/---------\
|(_)-------|
|----------|
-\_______/
Front

That little blank spot in the side view is simply a rectangular hole cut into 1-2 layers of PVC in the bolt, and on the front view there is a hole bored where the (_) is. The tip of the ejector slips through the hole, and the spring can be secured behind it. Then, the last layer of PVC is slipped on to close up the open side of the hole, and hide the ejector system.

[Commonly Hunted]

Yeah, that is what I think Bolt did but I'm wondering how he kept it from being pushed out by the spring.

He said he used a pin like in the FAR but it seems too small to me to do that. I was thinking of doing this:

___
|___|_X___________ 1/2"
|_________________| 15/32"

The X is a bit of 1/2" brass that is in the way of the nub on the ejector to retain it. The spring is behind the ejector of course but not drawn.