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My Longshot Modifications (56k Beware)

Personal problem solving and mod

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#1 The Inventor Guy

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 06:40 AM

Recenlty I came upon some problems with my Longshot. These included:
- Stefans would flip in the magazine
- There was a bad seal between barrel and bolt
- There was barely a barrel
- It was generally crap

So I decided to do something about the performance of my new $120 toy. Most of these modifications I have not seen or have been reported.
Here is a list of the modifications I performed, with a brief description, going into detail later:

>>AR Removal - Just like Carrtoon did with his
>>Plunger seal improval - Simple but effective
>>Spring replacement - Maxshot spring as per Piney's recommendation
>>Bolt seal improvement - And no dodgy holt glue seals!
>>Replaced the barrel - Aluminium is the new PVC...but not...
>>Modified the Magazine - Now accepts Stefans in a friendly manner

Plunger seal improval
This one was fairly simple.
- I lubed up the immediate inside of the plunger tube
- Applied excessive amount of hot glue around the plunger head after the face but before the O-ring
- While the glue was stil hot I placed it into the plunger tube so the glue would take shape.
- I removed the plunger and removed the excess glue; a better seal is made!

Spring Replacement
Those of you who have been keeping track with Carrtoon's Longshot Mod thread would know that Pineapple replaced his Longshot's stiok spring with a Maxshot spring adding that he stretched it. We did in fact need to stretch it; the spring was a few milimetres too short - it would rattle loosely on the plunger rod. So I stretched the spring from the only good condition Maxshot I had (I hate those things anyway) to maybe a half inch longer, maybe more, than the length of the stock spring. This increased the performance a singificant amount. It's not much louder than the stock springs with the AR's removed but feels more solid and kinda sounds like my BBB.

Bolt seal improvement and Barrel replacement
This is where my modification gets interesting. I actually had to do these modifications simultaneously - if I didn't do either one of the modifications, it would have half its performance as opposed to the double. I'll start with the barrel - it's not much, but it's significant in terms of performance.
Most of my barrels are pretty much Aluminium or 9/16" K&S Brass tube. Since brass costs $8.50 per foot and Aluminium $4.50 per metre (>3 ft.), I only buy Brass if I want to increase the reselling value of a blaster of if precision is of importance. The aluminium I buy is 1mx16mmx1mm, so the ID is 14mm or .55" - this fits my Stefans perfectly and will occasionally shoot a CTDS.
The almunium is durable, lightweight and cost effective.
During this modification, I didn't have any Aluminium so I 'borrowed' the Al out of a spare Universal Barrel I have for my Xbow, BBB, AT3k etc; I had labeled this barrel 9" but it is more like 9 1/4". Looking on it now, 10" would do just fine - 11" would be pushing it.
Posted Image

Method:
To add the Al barrel, I had to remove that dart-hindering-spring-loaded-prong thing sticking into the breech - this pushes a Streamline dart into the bolt/barrel when the gun is stock.
I applied < (one barrel circumference) length of tape to one end of the barrel and pushed it into the empty, disassembled breech. so it would stay there. I knifed a chamfer into the breech end of the barrel so darts could load easier.
Posted Image
(Sorry for that difficult angle - I thought I took another one...)
Some might ask why the barrel is so far forward. My answer? Efficiency. But to get good efficiency I had to take a risk - to cut the front of the bolt off.
This picture shows the reduced bolt face with the new seal:
Posted Image
In refference to the picture:
1. This picture is actually of the first seal idea I used. The seal is a single (2mm - gets squashed to 1mm) layer of a circle of craft foam sheet; the same stuff use in Zero darts. To cut the circle I made a cookie cutter with a scrap of the 16mm Al and some 10mm Al.
The next and last time I did it, I used two layers. This was much more efficient. The first layer was a circle of 1mm clear Vinyl sheet followed by the second layer of craft foam. This vinyl is the stuff used in temporary windows ie tents. This seal is much better than the former. If anyone was to perform this modification, I would recommend a layer of neoprene instead of foam, purely for longevity. Craft foam is just as good, but you'll need to replace it after a while.

One important thing that made a difference in the seal was the glue I used. I used super glue instead of hot glue since hot glue would come off of the bolt face after a bit of use.

To conclude coverage of the seal: I recommend using Super Glue, not Hot Glue and Neoprene instead of Craft foam.

2. I only cut to what I would call the extractor - the only part of the bolt that comes into contact with the dart to strip it from the magazine. that is as far as I cut it to. Any further than that and things would get difficult.
To apply the seal properly I had to cut a recess into that nub above the bolt there. This is so that the wall thickness is essentially the same the way around thus a more consistant seal and so that this nub could fit over the aluminium barrel and not get stuck on it.

Again, some of you might ask why I cut it down in the first place since Carrtoon didn't need to. Here's my answer:
Posted Image
What that blue/yellow arrow is pointing to is a gap. This gap is not big enough for the tang on the bolt to fit over/around. This is because of the OD of the aluminium. Though with a smaller OD the seal would be more difficult to accomplish.

Even if anyone used a different barrel type (ie CPVC or Brass - Yes CPVC does fit through the stock barrel. Hint: The CPVC you have in the U.S. has the same OD as my Aluminium.) I would still recommend a modification like I have done.
More pics of the bolt and barrel:
Bolt in the gun, assembled, bolt open
Bolt almost closed into the breach

I think that's all for the bolt and seal.

Magazine modification
This one is unique in all aspects.
To allow these magazines to work with short stefans without jamming, I had to modifiy them. The modification didn't invlove much that could potentially harm the performance of magazines if the mod was not succesful, but it could be reverted to stock if necessary.

The first thing I did was unscrew those two screws at the bottom of the magazine and literally rip the welded. I actually started with prying the button out on one side, but the other was still glued shut worse. sides open. You could cut it with a Dremel's Cut-Off wheel if you wanted it to be really neat, but you'd only have to super glue it together. I super glued mine anyway.

So, once I got the magazine open I marked 1-3/4" from the (directional arrow) front of the magazine. This is the maximum length of a Stefan I would be using. After that, I cut a straight strip of 4mm Acrylic sheet to 4mm wide - a rectangualar prism essentially. I superglued this strip next to the line, but made sure it was absolutely parrallel with the magazine walls.
Posted Image

The next thing I did was reinforce the magazine's follower with two layers of acrylic and then cut a 4.5mm groove into the side of the follower. I cut the grooves in the follower slightly bigger than the dimensions of the acrylic so it wouldn't jam in the acrylic insert if it tilted. I did these things to both sides of the magazine pieces.

This is harder to explain now that I'm getting tired, but this picture should wrap it up:
Posted Image

This modification prevents the darts from sliding back in the magazine as the bolt moves, thus letting them flip in the magazine. This also makes the darts more stable while in the magazine.

Posted ImagePosted Image
Here are some more pictures of the magazine modification.
If you try this mod, don't do it differently like this This was my first idea, but it kept jamming since the follower was too short. I did fix it though.
Comparison of a stock and modified magzine

To make a generalisation of this modification, I would say that it was all well worth it.
Ranges are consistant with my modified Crossbow, if not better and I think it may have better force too.\
So it would be safe to say I can consistantly get >100' with these modifications.
One thing I should say though, Stefan weights are a big factor in the performance of the Longshot - 1/4" BBs are best.

That's all I can say about my Longshot for now.
Are there any questions about a particular part of this modification?

Thanks, and please enjoy,
-Tidge.
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#2 AODL

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 08:51 AM

Nice mod, man. I'll definetly do this. But unless I am mistaken it was OMC who suggested the MS spring.

Edited by AODL, 19 October 2006 - 05:48 PM.

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#3 TheVeg

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 09:49 AM

Yes!!!! Thank you!!!

I have been waiting for a longshot barrel replacement write up! This is awesome! Should I use the barrel I use for airguns, or the barrel I use for spring guns? I have heard of people using loose barrels, but I need to confirm. Also, would this work with 9/16 brass? My stefans have a perfect sliding fit, and I don't want to change darts.

Thanks again,

-Veg
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#4 Forsaken angel24

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 11:22 AM

Cool write up. Why did you have to spend $120 to get this?
My only question is this:
Does the dart still get pushed into this peice or no?
Posted Image

Edited by Forsaken_angel24, 17 September 2006 - 11:23 AM.

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#5 hikaru

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 12:08 PM

Cool write up. Why did you have to spend $120 to get this?

My guess is shipping to Australia.
I had to pay $50US just for shipping (6lb package)
and $90USD is about $120AUD

EDIT: Longshots weigh about 6lb not 3-4lb

Edited by hikaru, 17 September 2006 - 12:39 PM.

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#6 pat 1st Lt

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 12:11 PM

I love the seal-improvement. A very creative idea. Overall, an excellent mod.

Have to ask the same question as Forsaken: does the dart still get pushed into the back section of the bolt, or does the new bolt-face push the dart straight into the barrel?

I really love the creativity in this mod. I also wonder why no-one else has thought of doing what you did to the magazine. If you use Stefans, chances are that you've had this problem before, and it isn't that hard a problem to solve. But congrats on being the first to write it up (To my knowledge at least).

Very good mod, and well documented.


-Pat

P.S. It's good to be back! I missed Nerf Haven. But I doubt that anyone noticed I was 'gone' in the first place. Except Vacc... And ompa. Oh well, it's good to be back. And Vacc: thanks for not making it 333.3 times worse for me.
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#7 General Cole

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 07:48 PM

Where do you get your aluminum? Did you cut off that prong that guided the dart/plunger barrell into the second barrell? Can we use the back a stock dart for the seal?
We should stop calling out/making fun of/pissing GC off. He's actually contributed and is available for trade. He's a better than average member no doubt. Got your back Cole.
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You know what... I know it's kinda late... but Props Cole.
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#8 Vaega

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 08:00 PM

Great writeup. I'll do this if I ever decide to get a longshot. Too bad I suck at modding.
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#9 sam

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 08:27 PM

How do your darts fit into your aluminum? Does it have a loose fit or a normal barrel fit? Awesome work.
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#10 CaptainSlug

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 09:07 PM

Does the dart still get pushed into this peice or no?

To add the Al barrel, I had to remove that dart-hindering-spring-loaded-prong thing sticking into the breech - this pushes a Streamline dart into the bolt/barrel when the gun is stock.

And based on the rest of the images the answer is no because the pieces that prevents the darts from being shoved into the barrel is both removed, and obstructed by the aluminum barrel replacement.
I'm not particularly fond of this method or the stefan length used.

This could be improved considerably with longer stefans and filling the excessive empty volume that's left in the modified bolt that no longer swallows the dart.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 17 September 2006 - 09:14 PM.

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#11 The Inventor Guy

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 02:00 AM

Question answerin' time.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question:

How are those ranges?

Answer:
You should read a little harder...

Ranges are consistant with my modified Crossbow, if not better and I think it may have better force too.
So it would be safe to say I can consistantly get >100' with these modifications.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question:

Should I use the barrel I use for airguns, or the barrel I use for spring guns? I have heard of people using loose barrels, but I need to confirm. Also, would this work with 9/16 brass? My stefans have a perfect sliding fit, and I don't want to change darts.
-................................................................................................................-
How do your darts fit into your aluminum? Does it have a loose fit or a normal barrel fit?

Answer:
My darts fit very nicely. I use this Aluminium with my AT3k, Crossbow and BBB. It works well for both springers and air guns. If you don't replace the spring, I would not recommend using brass unless your darts can slide into it.
You could use 9/16" brass in this modification, but it would be more difficult to calibrate a good seal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question:

Have to ask the same question as Forsaken: does the dart still get pushed into the back section of the bolt, or does the new bolt-face push the dart straight into the barrel?

Answer:
No, the dart gets pushed right into the barrel. If it didn't work like this, it wouldn't be as efficient in terms of the velocity of the dart and more difficult to acheive a good seal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question:

Where do you get your aluminum?

Answer:
I get my Almunium tube at my local hardware store. It's in the aisle with the fixings and also near the steel rack.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Did you cut off that prong that guided the dart/plunger barrell into the second barrell?

Answer:
...Can you see that prong? Sorry if it sounds blunt, but it is obvious. Like I said...

Again, some of you might ask why I cut it down in the first place since Carrtoon didn't need to. Here's my answer:
Image
What that blue/yellow arrow is pointing to is a gap. This gap is not big enough for the tang on the bolt to fit over/around. This is because of the OD of the aluminium. Though with a smaller OD the seal would be more difficult to accomplish...

In other words, the gap is not big enough for that prong to slide over the barrel and into the breech. Even if it was, I would need to cut the barrel at a weird shape to seal with the bolt properly, and that meant more chance of a bad seal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question:

Can we use the back a stock dart for the seal?

Answer:
You wouldn't be able to use backer rod or Nerf foam for the seal because it is simply not big enough. You need to use a seal as wide as the bolt itself. Also the pores or cells of the foam in FBR is too big for a seal. Craft foam is fairly close knit, so it's more effective.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I hope that answers your questions.
Anything else?

-Tidge.
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#12 AODL

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 06:55 AM

Oops, sorry about my obvious question. :o I'm a skimmer, I look over alot of stuff.
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#13 Dart Attack

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 05:35 PM

Very nice and clean mod!! Great idea.
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#14 VACC

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:00 PM

P.S. It's good to be back! I missed Nerf Haven. But I doubt that anyone noticed I was 'gone' in the first place. Except Vacc... And ompa. Oh well, it's good to be back. And Vacc: thanks for not making it 333.3 times worse for me.



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#15 spaceman

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Posted 04 October 2006 - 05:40 PM

Question:

How do your darts fit into your aluminum? Does it have a loose fit or a normal barrel fit?

Answer:
My darts fit very nicely.

odd, I've done a similar mod to mine (still working on the seal improvement), however the darts seem to be pushed too far upward out of the cartridge to the point that they clip the top of the barrel and jam every few times. Did you have this problem?
-Brad
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#16 The Inventor Guy

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Posted 04 October 2006 - 09:28 PM

I do have this problem occasionally.
To remedy it I either make my darts a slightly more rounded at the tip (on the edge of the foam - the bevel gives the dart a naturally more dynamic loading) and also I thought of a small rubber or spring-retractable piece of plastic that sits just above the barrel so as to guide the dart in properly and pulls away when the bolt gets there.
I guess a more simple thing to do is bend the back of the barrel out of shape so it has its own bevel and feeding ramp, so to speak.

The reason why the darts jam is because of the square edge of a stefan. if it is rounded boat-tail or ball-point, it wouldn't have this problem.

-Tidge.
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#17 Lizard Messiah

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Posted 22 October 2006 - 01:34 PM

Sorry if this topic is no longer hip, but I had a question.

I'm having the same problem as spaceman and TIG, except it happens every single time. I used a 9/16 brass barrel and I thought it best to keep it lower in the stock barrel to make it easier for the darts to load, but it seems they are repeatedly catching on the top edge. Should I simply relocate the barrel to a more central position? I'm not sure if this is entirely plausible, since the nub that the metal peg goes through (on the piece that pushes the dart into the barrel) may be unable to fit above the barrel. I guess my real question is this: TIG, where exactly is your Al barrel located in relation to the stock barrel? Does anyone have any suggestions/reprimands for asking stupid questions?
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#18 zoob

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 11:04 PM

can you give a litte more detail and pictures. i did it to my gun and it sucks. Where did you get the art foam

#19 nerfboi

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 11:13 PM

Umm, I'm not sure i fthis was mentioned in that little wiaver thing when you signed up, and I dont mean to back seat mod or anything, but you should refrain from posting in old topics like this one. Unless you have something important t ocontribute.
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#20 Willz

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Posted 28 June 2008 - 09:21 PM

Nice mod, not exactly an easy mod for noobs but still really coool
!
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#21 nerfer75

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Posted 28 June 2008 - 09:23 PM

This is over a year old. Stop Posting In Old Threads!
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#22 Tehmandude

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Posted 29 June 2008 - 01:26 AM

Wow...

Willz, you're fearless, aren't you? Like, you know, in a bad way?
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#23 GOOBER

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Posted 07 November 2009 - 10:04 AM

HI im an aussie too. i just paid pretty much the same amount for my nerf longshot and its still coming. but i need a barrel that fits 13mm FBR. if you can help me i would be really greatful. and i must say mate great job with the longshot!!
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#24 Icey

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Posted 07 November 2009 - 11:38 AM

You must really be a GOOBER to post in a year old thread...(go ahead and suspend me, I just had to say it)
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Haven't been on here since what...like 2006?


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