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130 vs 180 Pros/Cons

Is it really worth the work?

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#1 tetsuhau

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 11:43 AM

Working on a Rapidstrike and wondering if the shell modding and extra work is worth it. No huge Nerf wars nearby and most of my game time is in small basements. My plan is to run two IMR batteries on the stock motors. Will they melt? Is there a good 130 motor I can easily swap (a sort of middle ground)? Should I just suck it up and go all out (full trigger rewire and 180 swap)? Thanks in advance guys.

Edited by tetsuhau, 23 January 2015 - 11:44 AM.

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#2 J-Andy

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 12:36 PM

I say go 180 or stay stock. There are decent 130's but they cost as much or more than 180's and from what I have read they don't last very long. Three packs of Mabuchi 3240 180's on flea bay for $15 shipped. If you're gonna dig in, may as well make it worth the effort. However, I think for you style of Nerfing you would be better served just doing a wire upgrade and adding a bit of juice.
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#3 tetsuhau

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 01:17 PM

I say go 180 or stay stock. There are decent 130's but they cost as much or more than 180's and from what I have read they don't last very long. Three packs of Mabuchi 3240 180's on flea bay for $15 shipped. If you're gonna dig in, may as well make it worth the effort. However, I think for you style of Nerfing you would be better served just doing a wire upgrade and adding a bit of juice.


How tough is the conversion? Would you swap the pusher motor as well? Would three IMR batteries be safe at that point? So far on the wiring I have removed resistors on the flywheel motors and pusher motor, yanked out the thermistor and removed locks, other than the cycle completion switch of course. Would further wiring be the way to go with or without the motor swap?
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#4 J-Andy

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 01:38 PM

I wouldn't suggest IMR batteries at all. Maybe two if you stay stock and do re-wire. Three @ 11.1v on 180's will probably drain extremely fast. I have Xtreme Pro 180's in my RS and use a 2200mah 40C 3S lipo. I will take the liberty of saying I have no experience with IMR Tru$tfire type batteries. I avoided them all together based mostly on what I read regarding their capacities, reliablity, etc.
I left my RS pusher with the OE 130 but I plan to replace it as move into the second stage of my build. Also be advised that anything above 9v is said to cause run away fire problems. With my RS I use a Pololu 9v step down regulator on the pusher and it still tends to get out of control on occasion.
Nothing on the RS is overly complicated. If you want to simplify the process get the Blastersmiths UK switch and wiring kit (I highly recommend), Pop your motors in, run your wires, solder them up... and you're basically gtg.
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#5 tetsuhau

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 02:11 PM

I wouldn't suggest IMR batteries at all. Maybe two if you stay stock and do re-wire. Three @ 11.1v on 180's will probably drain extremely fast. I have Xtreme Pro 180's in my RS and use a 2200mah 40C 3S lipo. I will take the liberty of saying I have no experience with IMR Tru$tfire type batteries. I avoided them all together based mostly on what I read regarding their capacities, reliablity, etc.
I left my RS pusher with the OE 130 but I plan to replace it as move into the second stage of my build. Also be advised that anything above 9v is said to cause run away fire problems. With my RS I use a Pololu 9v step down regulator on the pusher and it still tends to get out of control on occasion.
Nothing on the RS is overly complicated. If you want to simplify the process get the Blastersmiths UK switch and wiring kit (I highly recommend), Pop your motors in, run your wires, solder them up... and you're basically gtg.


Stuck on the IMR setup for this blaster build because I also nerf with nephews. Easy to switch back to regular old AA. Also its been minimized making battery pack placement tricky. I will leave the wiring at resistor/lock removal and run two IMR. Thanks for all the info! Next build I will probably order the full 180 Rapid Pistol kit and new switches ect. As far as battery life goes, ill just have to bring spares unfortunately.
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#6 meishel

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 04:01 PM

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Stuck on the IMR setup for this blaster build because I also nerf with nephews. Easy to switch back to regular old AA. Also its been minimized making battery pack placement tricky. I will leave the wiring at resistor/lock removal and run two IMR. Thanks for all the info! Next build I will probably order the full 180 Rapid Pistol kit and new switches ect. As far as battery life goes, ill just have to bring spares unfortunately.


If you're worried about shooting too hard, you could buy a 1s LiPo as well, and then you're running at 3.7 volts which is similar to stock, but you'll have more current so spin up may be faster.

130 pros:
No shell cutting, which means easier to do, less tools required.
There are some decent options for less money than 180s.
With proper battery and re-wire, should be able get to or near the FPS ceiling for flywheels.
130 cons:
Gets hotter, mainly because they are smaller and get less air circulation because the shell is covering them.
Less torque.

180 Pros:
More torque.
Runs cooler due to having a larger shell to dissipate heat, and more than likely being exposed to outside air.
Blade motors are proven reliable.
180 Cons:
Shell modification required, Motor cover of some sort is highly recommended.
Cost is much more than many of the 130s on the market.
Can draw a LOT of current. IMRs not recommended. Many people use them on IMRs and say it's fine, but you're under utilizing them without a LiPo or NiMH pack with sufficient current.
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#7 tetsuhau

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 04:25 PM

If you're worried about shooting too hard, you could buy a 1s LiPo as well, and then you're running at 3.7 volts which is similar to stock, but you'll have more current so spin up may be faster.

130 pros:
No shell cutting, which means easier to do, less tools required.
There are some decent options for less money than 180s.
With proper battery and re-wire, should be able get to or near the FPS ceiling for flywheels.
130 cons:
Gets hotter, mainly because they are smaller and get less air circulation because the shell is covering them.
Less torque.

180 Pros:
More torque.
Runs cooler due to having a larger shell to dissipate heat, and more than likely being exposed to outside air.
Blade motors are proven reliable.
180 Cons:
Shell modification required, Motor cover of some sort is highly recommended.
Cost is much more than many of the 130s on the market.
Can draw a LOT of current. IMRs not recommended. Many people use them on IMRs and say it's fine, but you're under utilizing them without a LiPo or NiMH pack with sufficient current.


Thanks! Definitely doing 180's with my next build. When you guys are talking rewire, you mean pull the boards off the trigger box as well and start from scratch right? Or tacking back onto the board with better wire and starting new altogether?
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#8 meishel

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 05:04 PM

Thanks! Definitely doing 180's with my next build. When you guys are talking rewire, you mean pull the boards off the trigger box as well and start from scratch right? Or tacking back onto the board with better wire and starting new altogether?



Pretty much this http://torukmakto4.b...ated-guide.html

Again, i'd strongly suggest not doing IMRs with 180s. LiPo is so much better. :)
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#9 tetsuhau

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 05:06 PM

Pretty much this http://torukmakto4.b...ated-guide.html

Again, i'd strongly suggest not doing IMRs with 180s. LiPo is so much better. :)


Ya the conversion kit from Blastersmiths suggests a 2s 1000mAh pack. Would be the way I'd go on my next one.
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#10 meishel

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 06:49 PM

Ya the conversion kit from Blastersmiths suggests a 2s 1000mAh pack. Would be the way I'd go on my next one.


You might be able to swing a 2000+ mAh battery for a couple bucks more. Just check the measurements. Double battery life is always nice. :)
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#11 Lunas

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 06:57 PM

I have only done 1 thing to my rs at this point i modded the tray and put 2 18650 efest imr in.

looking back efest makes imr 26650 good up to 64A a 26650 is roughly the same around as a c cell but about 1 inch shorter than 2 c cells stacked so a spacer would need to be used.

btw a 26650 would be 3400mAh so 6800mAh of capacity beats the shit out of the 1000mAh 2s lipo and 30-64A vs 25A most 1000mAh lipo i have seen are 25c you take the c rating times the capacity to get the current dischargeable.

so a 26650 purple efest is roughly 50c.

Edited by Lunas, 23 January 2015 - 07:06 PM.

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#12 meishel

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 05:34 PM

It amazes me that the IMR batteries can achieve that level of mAh. I did a little looking into the 26650 cells, and it seems many of the manufacturers (including eFest) overstate the specs. The eFest purple's test more at 32A (which is still fine for our needs), a 1000mAh LiPo battery is TINY compared to what can fit in an RS. You can easily fit a 2200mAh 25c LiPo. I kinda want to try some of those large IMRs, but they're $20 for a pair. That's a huge hit compared to $10 for a 2200 mAh LiPo.
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#13 J-Andy

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 09:35 PM

I have only done 1 thing to my rs at this point i modded the tray and put 2 18650 efest imr in.

looking back efest makes imr 26650 good up to 64A a 26650 is roughly the same around as a c cell but about 1 inch shorter than 2 c cells stacked so a spacer would need to be used.

btw a 26650 would be 3400mAh so 6800mAh of capacity beats the shit out of the 1000mAh 2s lipo and 30-64A vs 25A most 1000mAh lipo i have seen are 25c you take the c rating times the capacity to get the current dischargeable.

so a 26650 purple efest is roughly 50c.


The efest purple is 3.7v (recommended discharge not to exceed 2.5a)@ 3500mah, two of these would make 7.4v @ 3500mah with 32a / 64a discharge ( or 3.7V @ 7000mah) and cost $25.30

A 40C 2200mah 3S lipo is 11.1v with 80a / 100a discharge (apples /oranges)

OR...... a zippy compact 2S Lipo 2200mah 60C (which will fit in the RS) would be 7.4V 2200mah 132a / 154a and costs $13.28 which is approximately the cost of one efest purple sub C. The 2S would eat the efests for breakfast lunch and dinner and a snack and breakfast the next morning and leave you with almost enough cash to order the BSUK switch and wiring kit. I don't understand why any one would want to go that route. If the sub C's were that great then no RC guy would be running Lipos in their rigs. I have about 12 Nimh sub C packs in an ammo box that never seen the light of day once I plugged in my first lipo pack.

But, regarding the Op's usage and my assumption he already has the IMR batts... they are probably a good choice for just a quick juice up for the basement battle with the younger kids. Cost wise not efficient but to really harness the power of the lipos you will require additional upgrades which probably aren't in his best interest atm.

Last thought, the stock 22 or 23 awg wire can fuse at around 10amps so if you want to juice up in any regard then a re-wire is really recommended. Last thing anyone wants is a slizzling blaster or a battery shorting out and popping.

Edited by J-Andy, 24 January 2015 - 10:06 PM.

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#14 Lunas

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 01:08 AM

The efest purple is 3.7v (recommended discharge not to exceed 2.5a)@ 3500mah, two of these would make 7.4v @ 3500mah with 32a / 64a discharge ( or 3.7V @ 7000mah) and cost $25.30

A 40C 2200mah 3S lipo is 11.1v with 80a / 100a discharge (apples /oranges)

OR...... a zippy compact 2S Lipo 2200mah 60C (which will fit in the RS) would be 7.4V 2200mah 132a / 154a and costs $13.28 which is approximately the cost of one efest purple sub C. The 2S would eat the efests for breakfast lunch and dinner and a snack and breakfast the next morning and leave you with almost enough cash to order the BSUK switch and wiring kit. I don't understand why any one would want to go that route. If the sub C's were that great then no RC guy would be running Lipos in their rigs. I have about 12 Nimh sub C packs in an ammo box that never seen the light of day once I plugged in my first lipo pack.

But, regarding the Op's usage and my assumption he already has the IMR batts... they are probably a good choice for just a quick juice up for the basement battle with the younger kids. Cost wise not efficient but to really harness the power of the lipos you will require additional upgrades which probably aren't in his best interest atm.

Last thought, the stock 22 or 23 awg wire can fuse at around 10amps so if you want to juice up in any regard then a re-wire is really recommended. Last thing anyone wants is a slizzling blaster or a battery shorting out and popping.

http://www.efestpower.com/Product/123409115.html

where did you pull your numbers from

i don't wish to quip back and forth on IMR vs li-po but they both have their places IMR has more uses than just nerf if you vape or have a high end flash lights just as lipo have uses in R/C vehicle and nerf. Yes li-po are the best choice but i prefer IMR.

Edited by Lunas, 25 January 2015 - 01:09 AM.

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#15 J-Andy

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 10:21 AM

http://www.efestpower.com/Product/123409115.html

where did you pull your numbers from

i don't wish to quip back and forth on IMR vs li-po but they both have their places IMR has more uses than just nerf if you vape or have a high end flash lights just as lipo have uses in R/C vehicle and nerf. Yes li-po are the best choice but i prefer IMR.


Where did I pull my numbers from?? Your link shows exactly what I quoted for the efest purple. Two efest purple wired in series would be 7.4v @ 3500mah 32 / 64 and two wired in parallel would be 3.7v @ 7000mah. Thats according to your link.

Specs for the zippy compact 2S 60C 2200mah are shown here
2200mah is 2.2a, 2.2a x 60C (continuous)= 132a.
2.2a x 70c (burst)= 154a

Specs for the zippy compact 3S 40C 2200mah are shown here
2200mah is 2.2a, 2.2a x 40C (continuous)= 88a.
2.2a x 50C (burst)= 110a

My point was only that it seems a bit ridiculous to pay more (or the same) for less... but hey, to each their own I guess.
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#16 tetsuhau

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 10:46 AM

Hey everybody. I remained stock motors and rewired. Two IMR batteries give me an edge over the group I nerf with and the battery tray will let me put 3 AA batteries in it so when the little ones are laughing and randomly firing in the air I can join them with an under powered pea shooter. I WILL be building another RS. Next time I WILL order kits from Blastersmiths. Battery packs WILL power the beast on 180's. This build though is my go to. Like having a daily driver before I sink into a project car. I can lay waste to my friends and be the cool uncle. Waiting on parts yet. When it's out of paint I'll post pictures.

Edited by tetsuhau, 26 January 2015 - 10:47 AM.

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#17 meishel

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:04 PM

Hey everybody. I remained stock motors and rewired. Two IMR batteries give me an edge over the group I nerf with and the battery tray will let me put 3 AA batteries in it so when the little ones are laughing and randomly firing in the air I can join them with an under powered pea shooter. I WILL be building another RS. Next time I WILL order kits from Blastersmiths. Battery packs WILL power the beast on 180's. This build though is my go to. Like having a daily driver before I sink into a project car. I can lay waste to my friends and be the cool uncle. Waiting on parts yet. When it's out of paint I'll post pictures.


The Demolisher works really well for general nerfing with just upgrading to IMRs so I don't blame you. If you're playing with little ones, using a LiPo and 180's is just mean.
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#18 tetsuhau

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:09 PM

Agreed that's why I even went down to three AA when I'm with them. But ya I do nerf with friends so IMR and full auto is enough to wreck them and their fresh out the box blasters.
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