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Sharpshooting Ladder Attachment

More effective than a scope

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#1 Carrtoon

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Posted 23 July 2006 - 11:21 PM

I've used scopes on my guns for quite some time now. They've worked ok, but with removeable barrels, they were pretty much useless. I remembered a ladder sight on one of the guns in BFD 2 and thought it might be worth trying. It was. Here's what I made:

Posted Image

Posted Image

It's a simple and effective mod to do. All you need is your barrel, two cpvc T connectors, a dremel, a small piece of cpvc, 4 tiny circles of cpvc, a few inches of 1/2" PVC, and glue.

I started out by drilling out the center of one of the T connectors. I then pressed it about 4 inches onto the barrel. I took the other T connector and put it on the front of the barrel. Next, I cut a notch out of the few inches of PVC and put the 4 cpvc circles in the notch. You can either glue the circles in, or get the PVC that the 1/2" PVC nests in and cut a few small circles to hold the piece together. Now, add the ladder sight to the front T connector. Then, I cut the small piece of cpvc to a point and pressed it into the other T connector. Add a coupler to your gun and you're finished. Simple and effective.

This is better than any sight I've used. The aim is incredible due to having the ladder sight and because the sight is actually mounted to the barrel. After you get to know the range of the dart at certain distances and where the dart falls, you can use the ladder to your advantage. Scopes are meant for guns that have very little drop in the line of fire. Nerf guns have lots of drop after certain distances. The ladder scope was meant for arching grenades and the same concept applies to nerf guns. Looking down the sight:

Posted Image
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#2 Team Slaya

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Posted 23 July 2006 - 11:46 PM

First of all, those pics are really nice. /jealous @ Carrtoon's nice camera.

Nice idea! This seems to be something that would actually help one's aim, unlike the scopes that lots of people talk about, e.g. red dot scopes and magnifying scopes, which are pretty useless. This is simple, effective, and explained well.

I love your stuff, keep it up.

TS
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#3 Flaming Hilt

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 01:25 AM

You should, uh, reproduce and sell those for those of us without dremels. *cries*

Or just bring one to NO SPAM.

Really nice job. Your brain's level of innovation is unbelievable. I mean, holy flip. Nice job.
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#4 davenelz

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 02:16 AM

it looks cool, but I'm curious as to how the lbb is primed/pumped.
do you have it rigged to some compressor?
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#5 elf avec gun

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 10:05 AM

Bring at least three to NOSPAM I will pay cash!
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#6 sam

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 12:01 PM

it looks cool, but I'm curious as to how the lbb is primed/pumped.
do you have it rigged to some compressor?

I'd bet he's got one of his kick ass dual action bike pumps hooked up to it. It should take about ten pumps to get it fully primed.
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#7 AssassinNF

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 04:17 PM

Finally, a Nerf sight that works.

Great Job, Carrtoon!
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#8 Paloose

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 04:36 PM

Sweet, I've been thinking of this since I saw the ladder sight on the M-79 grenade launcher, but I couldn't find out a way to get ranges accurately measured with the sights bars. Did you just put the bars on and just use it without precise ranges or did you just guesstimate?
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#9 pat 1st Lt

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 04:45 PM

Sweet, I've been thinking of this since I saw the ladder sight on the M-79 grenade launcher, but I couldn't find out a way to get ranges accurately measured with the sights bars. Did you just put the bars on and just use it without precise ranges or did you just guesstimate?



Well, since he said that

After you get to know the range of the dart at certain distances and where the dart falls, you can use the ladder to your advantage.

I'd assume he didn't really measure before-hand. I think he just cut the grooves, and then learned what range each groove coincided with.





Sincereley,
Pat
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#10 NerfMonkey

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 04:54 PM

I really don't get it at all.

I get how you constructed it and the pieces used, but how the hell do you aim with it? Do you line up the point on the first piece of CPVC with the little circles in the ladder part? Does this mean that the lower rings in the ladder would be longer ranges since the gun is angled up more, in order to line them up with the pointed piece of CPVC?

And then the topmost rings of the ladder would be for shorter ranges since the dart wouldn't drop as much, so the gun would be angled less for the point on the CPVC to line up with the little rings?

Tell me if I'm wrong. If I'm right that's a really nifty device you've got there.
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#11 AssassinNF

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 05:12 PM

I really don't get it at all.

I get how you constructed it and the pieces used, but how the hell do you aim with it? Do you line up the point on the first piece of CPVC with the little circles in the ladder part? Does this mean that the lower rings in the ladder would be longer ranges since the gun is angled up more, in order to line them up with the pointed piece of CPVC?

And then the topmost rings of the ladder would be for shorter ranges since the dart wouldn't drop as much, so the gun would be angled less for the point on the CPVC to line up with the little rings?

Tell me if I'm wrong. If I'm right that's a really nifty device you've got there.


Yep, that's right.
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#12 Carrtoon

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Posted 24 July 2006 - 06:50 PM

Thanks. Yeah, the LBB is hooked up to a bike pump. I haven't mounted it yet, it was just so I could try out the sight. I can bring a few to sell possibly. As to range, it's firing over and over again and knowing how far you need to elevate the gun for the distance. I didn't glue the circles in, so they can be adjusted to where I want. And yes, NerfMonkey and AssassinNF, you are right about how it works.
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#13 Master Yogurt

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Posted 25 July 2006 - 09:17 AM

That was an utterly genius idea. This was how cannoneer in the Civil War would sight the cannon before firing- with a ladder attachment so they could estimate distance. Attaching one to a Nerf gun was simply amazing - what's most amazing is that no one's thought of it before. That's the most genius inventions, though - the ones that make people go "wait... Why didn't I think of that?"

And, yeah, its's all about guesstimating and remembering previous experience.
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#14 z80

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Posted 25 July 2006 - 11:19 AM

A similar concept I've had is a golf scope. People are alittle shorter than the flags, and you align the line in the scope with the flag, and it will tell you how far away from the flag. Then angle apropriatly. I think its a little work, but cartoon, your idea is awesome. One problem I've been having is angling my gun and still aiming correctly. This should help.
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#15 LastManAlive

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 09:40 PM

I planned to do this once to a gun that got good range, but it just kept needing to be worked on, so I decided not to since it would most likely be useless in the future. I was going to do something like what you did, yet it would be a sliding rail type. You know, you depress a button on the side of the front sight and slide it forward is the target is closer and back it is farther. I may do this with a xbow once I get one. I also thought about a tang sight. About the same thing you have there, yet the sights are switched. I have a tang on my 45-70, and it is so vintage and fun to shoot with. You pick the range you are going to be shooting and fire. I droped a fairly desent 6-point deer with it last deer season. You just have to experiment with it some to see where you need to aim for when aiming uphill and for downhill as well.

The only thing I have against your making, is the front sight. I know that once you get running, you may pull a quick shot off, see someone shoot, get one of those rushes, and roll. Sad thing is, you desided to roll half way through your reload phase, and now have your front site sticking in your eye OOOOOH NOOOOOOZ!!!the big 111!! Now, we don't want any of that do we? So I suggest you make a safer front site OR you make a safer front site!
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#16 Carrtoon

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 10:21 PM

Your ideas sound pretty good. Try some things and let me know how it goes.

As to safety, screw it! I hate all of this gripe about safety. I don't mean to say that safety goggles are a dumb thing to wear. I wouldn't nerf without some form of glasses on. I never go cycling without my helmet after a crash that happened a few years ago, but what's next? Am I going to have to have my mommy cut my plastic on the band saw so I don't chop my fingers off?

The whole point of the pointed sight is accuracy and a minimal obstruction of view. It works well an I'm not going to let a tiny possiblity, like the one you brought up, change the design. Thanks for the worry though! I'll use it at my own risk and hope I don't sue myself for not putting a warning label on it. B)
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#17 Carbon

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Posted 29 July 2006 - 07:29 PM

True, it is possible to be too safe, but that is a CPVC dagger you have on that gun. :)

You could cut the CPVC down, and use it to connect large vinyl tubing cut to the same shape, or thin plastic rolled into a tube (like 2-liter plastic), both painted, of course. Either one would allow the tip to collapse rather than puncture.

Either way, great thinking Carrtoon!

Edited by Carbon, 29 July 2006 - 07:37 PM.

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#18 LastManAlive

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 01:57 PM

To tell you the truth, the 2 liter plastic is more dangerous. It is thinner, thus having less surface area, and will go deeper if falled on.

I'm not a safety nut, I just meant that not a lot of people may not allow it in a war, I mean, I blow 2 liter bottels of water up from 5 feet with that 45-70 riflfe of mine. They will be speaking my language with it not being safe either. You might want to try something a littel more flexible, but something that still takes its original shape again. You might want to try bending a peice of suder flux in the shape of the point. If fallen on, the flux would bend away, but you could take it off via CPVC and the coupler on the gun and fix it in mid battel.

Either that, or try to get a hold of memory metal. You can bend it out of shape and everthing, just add heat, and it springs back to life. The trick is, to get into that bent, pointy shape.
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#19 pat 1st Lt

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 02:26 PM

To tell you the truth, the 2 liter plastic is more dangerous. It is thinner, thus having less surface area, and will go deeper if falled on.

I'm not a safety nut, I just meant that not a lot of people may not allow it in a war, I mean, I blow 2 liter bottels of water up from 5 feet with that 45-70 riflfe of mine. They will be speaking my language with it not being safe either. You might want to try something a littel more flexible, but something that still takes its original shape again. You might want to try bending a peice of suder flux in the shape of the point. If fallen on, the flux would bend away, but you could take it off via CPVC and the coupler on the gun and fix it in mid battel.

Either that, or try to get a hold of memory metal. You can bend it out of shape and everthing, just add heat, and it springs back to life. The trick is, to get into that bent, pointy shape.



Personally, I think large diameter Vinyl tube would work best: cuttable, felxable, cheap, easily available, and (I believe certain sizes do) fits in CPVC couplers.

Also, you know how expensive memory metals are? Last time I checked, they were very very expensive, and not easily available. Also, even if they can bend, the fact remains that it takes a certain amount of force to bend those metals. And since we're still talking about a metal spike, I wouldn't want to find out the hard way how much force it takes to bend them.



Sincereley,
Pat
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It gave the site a sort of 'homy' feeling.

Did you know that "m" can sometimes look like "rn" when read quickly?

#20 Nomyud

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 09:52 AM

I feel sorry for anyone that runs into you and gets stabbed by your site ;0
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#21 SG Pilot

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 02:17 PM

The sight you made there looks much like the ones for a grenade launcher as seen below:

This M79 as you can see has one.
Posted Image
Posted Image
Another one seen above.

Because you often have to aim indirectly with nerf guns for longer range attacks, your sight is perfect. Nice job and good thinking!

Edited by SG Pilot, 09 August 2006 - 02:19 PM.

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#22 Guest_Nerf_*

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 03:23 AM

I like it, but wont u might hurt yourself on the sharp part?
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#23 The Inventor Guy

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 06:50 AM

With everyone talking about the safety of that sight, why does it even have to pointy? No matter what it's made of - craft foam, duct tape, vinyl - it would still have the ability to pucture an eyeball.
So, you can either shut up about the site as it's probably just a prototype and for testing in this stage at the moment, or you can keep whinging more about safety and maybe, just MAYBE even be bothered to think of an altarnative.

Perhaps he could use a rear site the same height with a squared, flat edge.
In the middle of this he could cut out a 1cm (or smaller) groove/notch/sight to look through instead of around.
Like a real rear sight?
Even this LOOKS safer, but it isn't necessarily.
You decide.
Here's a concept pic of the rear sight: (ignore the Periods).
...__ .....__
.|##|...|##|
.|##|__|##|
.|#######|
.|#######|

-Tidge.

Edited by The Inventor Guy, 10 August 2006 - 06:53 AM.

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#24 Lancaster

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 06:38 PM

Am I right in thinking they had ladder sights on British Bren LMGs? I thought I saw those in COD...


Nice mod, I'd try it on my NF if it was practical for a sidearm, it arcs like crazy.
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#25 LastManAlive

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 11:19 AM

With safety being pressed tightly here, you may want to make the rear sight lower. I suggest you cut the tip of your read sight 1/2inch off, and lower the whole sighting system. Much like a scope on a rifle with mounts that let you use the iron sights, the rings also make the scope go h ire, thus the limit to your accuracy it lowered. You will be less accurate at curtain ranges now that the sight is higher. Thus, brings the sight system down, you are able to increase the limits on the accuracy. I would show you complex calc diagrams, but there would be no point for you have to understand limits...lets just say, that you will have better accuracy now.
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