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Punch Into A Shot?


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#1 Trogdorian Grey

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 12:53 PM

I used to have these realy nice wrist blasters back in the day (oh, and please PM me if you have any for sale/trade), but they didn't have that great of a range. I always found myself being outranged by LNLs or other sidearms once the main weapons were out.....untill I figured punching into the shots would drasticly increase the range. It takes alot of practice, but it's a technique that works for any gun (funny enough, even the Titan), the wrist blasters were just easier to get the hang of. You have to make sure you fire before your arm reaches full momentum, otherwise the benifit of the thrust will be lost to the decelleration of your arm reaching its full stretch. Also keep in mind that this is a tradeoff of accuracy for range.
I was just wondering if anyone else does this?
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#2 merlinski

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 01:20 PM

I have a hard time believing that this makes any noticable difference in a gun with decent range. All you're doing is increasing the initial velocity of the dart, but the speed at which you can punch with a gun in your hand is significantly less than the velocity of a dart exiting a barrel.
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#3 achensherd

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 01:24 PM

I do it sometimes with my Maverick, and it does seem to benefit some, but not by much. The Maverick is pretty inaccurate as it is (with stefans... maybe just mine)... punching into each shot makes the dart velocity higher (slightly more range), but at the cost of even more accuracy.

Edited by achensherd, 23 June 2005 - 01:25 PM.

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#4 Talio

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 01:55 PM

Actaully, when playing unmodded this was an extremely vital skill. We used to call it leading or flicking the shot. It's almost like you're throwing the shot and for the 4 or 5 years where we seriously used guns like the eagle eye to make 30 - 40 foot shots, it was absolutely deadly. Problem was, anyone who showed up new couldn't get it down. It was something we had always done, so we had it practically perfected. I still catch myself liking worse shooting weapons because I can arch and flick a shot more accurately then I can flat shoot. For a while I got some critisism that arching shots was not a viable aiming strategy, yet it was effective as all hell pretty much all the time.

Here's how to look at it. All you're basically doing is arching the shot and giving it a little throw while you're at it. An arched shot on a 2k makes it fire clear over 100 feet, by far. Problem is, it's completely inaccurate. That's mainly because it's so damn far away. Figure that target is tiny from that range. However, if they're 30 feet off, and your gun just lands 20 - 30 feet flat, a little flick of the wrist makes that dart fly.

It's also pretty hard to dodge. What I've noticed is most players keep pretty much to one plane. They see the game in flat shots and flat dodges, all on one level. This way, you can see where a gun is pointing, know when they're going to shot and prepare yourself. However an arched shot normally falls above peoples flat line of sight. So pretty much what happens is that they consider it will not hit, because it looks like a wild shot. They'll probably move one way or another, but if properly lead you can nail right where they are moving too. Also with it out of sight there are only two things to do. One is look up and follow the dart, which normally slows people down. If you can't see the ground, human nature will not want you to run and move really fast, because you're not confident in your footing. Take a look next time you walk, you survey the ground before you walk over it. In most cases, they're nature will stop them from running out of the way. The other thing you could do is just try to move out of the way without really keeping your eye on the dart, which is not an effective way to dodge and normally you under do it and get hit on the shoulder on sides of your torso.

Now keep in mind that these shots don't go that high, they merely skim higher then most modded players are used to. And really they go pretty fast, the slight arch of the shot makes it seem slow, but really it almost acts as if gravity is helping it pick up speed on the downward angle.

So is this a viable strategy and firing method? You bet your ass. However, it takes a long time to learn and perfect. If you have this down and are efficient at it, keep it up, because it will give you an edge. The only weakness is, you have to be close. This is Nerf, who the hell wants to shoot someone from far away?

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#5 Trogdorian Grey

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 01:56 PM

Merlinski: Imagine you throw a rubber ball at ten miles an hour. Now imagine throwing the ball at ten miles an hour while riding a bike at fifteen. You get a twenty five mile per hour toss instead with the same effort. This is how this works. However, there is a limit to it set by the terminal velocity of the dart. The darts being such a lightweight foam, air resistance hinders it alot, which is why despite the best mods and even using c02 people can't seem to get much more than 150' out of anything dart sized. This just helps to get it to that maximum velocity, so guns that are already close to that (such as a modded SM1500) won't benifit as much as, say, a scout pistol.
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#6 Pineapple

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 02:15 PM

You know Talio, I really thought you'd have a differing opininon on 'punching' a shot, but your extensive experience, even with the 'unmodified' days of Nerfing, really educated me. I'm actually going to give it a try with unmodded pistols.

But I question the practicality of it in the style of play we Nerf (close quarters building infiltration/ fast paced outdoor eliminations), only because the extra 10-20 feet or so is grossly affected by the inconsistent accuracy (probably gets better with practice), and superfluous movement when it's already hard to get a fairly steady bead on the run at 40-50 feet anyway with my 2k. If I needed the extra few feet, I'd rather move in than flick my hand. That's just me.


But really interesting reading. I'm going to give it a try.


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#7 Talio

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 02:39 PM

I'm trying to think of a pointer I can give. Even indoors it would work. It means the shot will almost be on an upstroke, but that's getting too techincal. Think of it really like throwing the dart and you will gain some accuracy. Also make sure you follow through and at some point your gun is pointing directly where you want it to land. It's hard to say because it's almost a sixth sense type of thing. Just knowing what to do. I'm not saying I'm perfect at it, but it will become fluid if you practice at it.
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#8 merlinski

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Posted 23 June 2005 - 04:32 PM

Merlinski: Imagine you throw a rubber ball at ten miles an hour. Now imagine throwing the ball at ten miles an hour while riding a bike at fifteen. You get a twenty five mile per hour toss instead with the same effort. This is how this works. However, there is a limit to it set by the terminal velocity of the dart. The darts being such a lightweight foam, air resistance hinders it alot, which is why despite the best mods and even using c02 people can't seem to get much more than 150' out of anything dart sized. This just helps to get it to that maximum velocity, so guns that are already close to that (such as a modded SM1500) won't benifit as much as, say, a scout pistol.

I understand why it works, but you missed my point. I was saying that this is more like being able to throw a rubber ball 75 miles an hour, and then riding a bike 5 miles an hour while doing it. Yeah, you get the whole 80 mile per hour throw, but the increase is range is relatively small compared to the stability you lose. I was thinking along the lines of modified guns, so I guess that if you have a pistol with 20 feet of stock range then it could be useful.
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#9 mayhem

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Posted 24 June 2005 - 03:25 AM

This 12 year old kid that plays with us sometimes does that with his Nite Finder. It is crazy,he easily gets 10 ft farther by doing that and amazingly enough has practised enough that he doesn't lose much accuracy.
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#10 Talio

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Posted 24 June 2005 - 08:03 AM

I gotta tell you, on modded guns it's kind of useless. For the most part this tactic only works within 40 - 50 feet and most guns (even mine) can shoot that flat accurately. This should mainly be reserved for pistols or old school guns. Even at that, my old school crossbow still performs well enough that it's not needed.

Mayhem, it's deadly. I swear this is why I like to keep my guns at lower ranges. It almost seems like it's a more reliable shot. Airguns that shoot darts (aka, really straight) are nice, but the problem is not with the gun or technique. It's mainly that a dart isn't the most accurate thing in the world and is easily influenced by enviromental conditions. Guys who can do it wreck house. I've seen Famine do it from time to time with his crossbow and all his shots fall pretty damn close to the mark. It's a good skill to have, but like I said, with modded primaries and even some pistols, it's pretty much moot.

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