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Multistage flywheel setup


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#1 V8sr4u

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 08:28 PM

I currently have access to two 3d printers and found an interesting idea on thingiverse. I searched flywheel cages and found a multistage setup. I recently broke my bb Brute, so I thought I might go with a multistage, since I think I need new motors and micro switches. I was thinking rhinos and I found some switches. I thought about using two lipos with resistors for the multistage setup. Do you guys think a multistage setup is a bad approach?


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#2 Meaker VI

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 10:49 AM

Multistage is ok, but personally, I'm more excited about large-wheel single-stage as those are getting FPS in the 180s and up now. They require custom builds, but so do multistagers.
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#3 IAmAPenguin

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 06:16 AM

Multistage setups can achieve ridiculous fps and consistency as seen by Eli Wu's 'hex' achieving around 200 fps on elites with a 3-stage brushless setup. I am currently planning a 3-stage, select fire, brushless rayven with 3 modified OFP 41.5mm cages printed in steel with worker high crush wheels and 9 various sizes of brushless motors climing to 60000rpm on the final stage. I would highly recommend trying a 2-3 stage setup using 180s or if you can afford it, brushless motors (though that is a very complex system). Im sure the community would love to see something like that in the future. Last thing, there is no need to use 2 lipos if you wire the 4 motors in parallel. You can simply just use a high-capacity LiPo with a high discharge rate (i'd recommend a Turnigy 2000mAh 65C graphene LiPo, either 2s or 3s depending on what motors you are using).
Hope you found this helpful!

Edited by IAmAPenguin, 07 September 2017 - 07:34 AM.

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#4 Meaker VI

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 09:06 AM

I am currently planning a 3-stage, select fire, brushless rayven with 3 modified OFP 41.5mm cages printed in steel with worker high crush wheels and 9 various sizes of brushless motors climing to 60000rpm on the final stage.

Besides recent developments that allow single stages to get that kind, or near enough that kind, of performance, you've got some expensive parts planned that my research says do no better than regular stuff.

First, brushless motors are not magically better than brushed for our use. After market brushed motors can do everything brushless can; the only reason to go brushless is if you want to mount a larger wheel, which shouldn't need multistage. If you've got a specific reason for brushless (e.g.: longevity), by all means spend more.

Second: printing in metals isn't the same as building a part with metals. If you're using a regular FDM/FFF extruder printer, plastic (or a resin) is still doing all the work, the part might just be slightly heavier.

Edited by Meaker VI, 07 September 2017 - 09:07 AM.

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#5 blitz

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:39 AM

I currently have access to two 3d printers and found an interesting idea on thingiverse. I searched flywheel cages and found a multistage setup. I recently broke my bb Brute, so I thought I might go with a multistage, since I think I need new motors and micro switches. I was thinking rhinos and I found some switches. I thought about using two lipos with resistors for the multistage setup. Do you guys think a multistage setup is a bad approach?

Talk to OpenFlywheel Project about making a dual-stage Brute cage if they haven't already. Definitely something he should do. 
 

You're going to need new switches, motors, battery (LiPo), etc. for standard flywheel builds. Double-staged setups usually require far bigger capacity/discharge batteries and definitely also higher-KRPM motors. Also, get one battery and don't run more than one battery together. I can't explain the physics behind it, but just don't. 

Multi-stagers require massive amounts of torque and a higher RPM - translating to quicker recovery and spinup time. Rhinos are inferior to Hellcats, Fangs, Cronus-X, and the Wolverine in standard single-stage builds, and would be severely inferior or even unworkable in double-stage.  

The closely arranged motor wells in the OFP stryfe/rapidstrike dual cage were designed to use supercritical (e.g. with RPM over ~35000) such as the MTB Wolverine (44000). I saw NerfGeek's dual-stage Wolverine Rapidstrike at APOC before it died and it was pretty terrifying. A Redditor made a Demolisher with a OFP dual cage and Fangs (if I recall) and was chronying 195 fps. 

Meaker is right, brushless motors are advantageous because you can mount larger wheels on outrunners without the performance death that you'd get with large wheels and regular brushed setups – though this seems to be a territory reserved mainly for flywheel homemades, not modification of existing blasters. These larger wheels can garner results that are achieved with multi-stage brushed blasters (Toruk's Hy-con wheels were getting ~180, the FDL-2 can achieve 160-170 regularly). There are exceptions in modification, but that's their obvious application and benefit. It requires a lot more wiring/parts to regulate the speed of the motors. 

 


Edited by blitz, 13 September 2017 - 09:34 AM.

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