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[REVIEW] Knock-off Elite Suction Darts!

with youtube video

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#1 ravetrooper

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Posted 23 February 2015 - 10:04 PM

Hi everyone! Welcome to my first NERF-related review. I hope you find it helpful.


VIDEO:
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=BJrWbocMWj4
EDIT: Finally figured out how to post the video thumbnail!

BACKSTORY:

So a few months ago I started running low on elite darts and I didn't want to invest any more money in those for the obvious reasons: high cost and terrible accuracy. Around that same time I had the opportunity to try out some of the newer elite suction darts and I absolutely loved them. I thought about buying some to refill my arsenal but found out that the largest available package was only 30 darts for 12ish dollars. I heard about Koosh darts and did some research on those and found all of the complaints about foam inconsistency and gluing quality issues. I decided to stalk ebay for knock-off darts until I found something better... and I think I finally did!


REVIEW:

In January I found what appeared to be elite-style suction dart knock-offs for really, really cheap (the listing I won was a 150 pack for 6 dollars!)
20150223_174907_zpse6edcd54.jpg

I ordered from an ebay seller named "eforco." From the time I placed the order, the package took about 3 and a half weeks to arrive (free shipping from China). The first thing I noticed upon removing the darts from the package is that the foam is more dense than NERF brand foam. This suprised me because I assumed the quality would be at least a little less due to the cost. The darts are about 1/32" wider (for a snug fit in springers) and 1/16" longer than NERF elite darts [just the foam portion, not including the tip] I thought that the length difference would be a probblem and cause jams, but I have yet to get any blaster to jam up with these darts.
The suction cup itself is a new material I haven't seen on a dart before. It's similar to the stuff that those suction cups on the back of shower racks are made of. It is also a translucent neon salmon color, which glows brightly under black or blue light (the picture I took makes them look opaque for some reason...). In terms of manufacturing inconsistency, I have yet to find one example. The suction tips are glued on extremely well [see video for stress test comparison to elite darts] and are consistently centered on the foam. One thing to note is that the "stem" of the dart tip is about twice as long as an elite dart, so these might not work in newer blasters that still have the barrel post(s) in them. The darts also fly very accurately (indoor ranges, I have'nt been able to test them outside due to weather interference.) I actually haven't lost a single dart yet because they group so well. ALSO: the "chance" of sticking to a flat surface is much higher than the NERF elite suction darts (they bounce off a lot less.) I believe this is because the size of the suction cup on the knock-offs is larger and the material is more smooth.



OVERALL PROS AND CONS

PROS:

~EXTREMELY low-cost! (current price is $12 for 200 darts)
~Good foam density (tight fit in springers)
~Great manufacturing consistency (at least in my lot)
~Really accurate!!
EDIT~Wider suction tip could make for a better air-seal in homemade barrels

CONS:

~Harder to find & price can vary
~May not fit in all stock barrels (all of my blasters have the barrel posts removed so I haven't been able to confirm or deny this.)
EDIT: ~ NERF barrel extensions hinder range even more than elite darts because the suction tip is wider and drags on the inside of the barrel more.

SELLERS:

eforco: http://www.ebay.com/...w=nerf&_sacat=0
eboxoon: http://www.ebay.com/...w=nerf&_sacat=0
free_company: http://www.ebay.com/...w=nerf&_sacat=0

EDIT: Just to clarify, this the pic you should see on ebay of the specific darts I got. There are listings where you have to select the dart type and I believe those are also the same product. Those usually have a picture of a tommy 20 with a variety of dart types pictured under it. RaveDartPic_1_zps922fd229.jpg

EDIT: MORE PICS (upon request) http://nerfhaven.com..._DIR#/smile.gif

20150224_103642-1_zps03c9f6e8.jpg
-I managed to find an old suction dart to compare tips. The new dart stems seem to actually be about 1/16" longer than the elite suction dart's- (yes I finally managed to "remove" a dart tip from the knock-offs haha)

20150224_103503-1_zps00202e1b.jpg
-despite an advertised dart length of 2.7" these are in fact longer than elite darts. Chinese inches must be different or something?

Thanks everyone for your time and feedback!

~Rave

3-01-15 EDIT: Added extra pro/con regarding the width of the suction tip.

Edited by ravetrooper, 12 December 2015 - 12:31 PM.

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Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#2 Gin

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 08:17 AM

thanks for the heads up rave! i might just have to pick some of these up...
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#3 Blood Angel

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 08:29 AM

Great Review.

All three listings that you have provided advertise the dart length at 2.7 inches = 6.858 cm. The length of an official Nerf™ Elite streamline dart is 2.874 inches = 7.3 cm.

What this means is that these darts will NOT feed properly into any nerf flywheel blaster (without modification). If you plan to use these darts in a nerf setting where others might happen to pick up these darts up and use them in a flywheel blaster, then it may cause an issue.

If you could advance your review by including a side by side picture of one of these next to an elite dart, that would be very helpful. Also, I would like to know the weight of these darts: both overall and the weight of the tips by themselves (again pictures would give us a better idea of the dart balance, since you mention the stem being longer).

Again, great review. It takes a lot of guts to invest money into an unknown, never seen before product, and I am glad you did. I bought some of these and will look it them myself.
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#4 ravetrooper

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 12:52 PM

Great Review.

All three listings that you have provided advertise the dart length at 2.7 inches = 6.858 cm. The length of an official Nerf™ Elite streamline dart is 2.874 inches = 7.3 cm.

What this means is that these darts will NOT feed properly into any nerf flywheel blaster (without modification). If you plan to use these darts in a nerf setting where others might happen to pick up these darts up and use them in a flywheel blaster, then it may cause an issue.

If you could advance your review by including a side by side picture of one of these next to an elite dart, that would be very helpful. Also, I would like to know the weight of these darts: both overall and the weight of the tips by themselves (again pictures would give us a better idea of the dart balance, since you mention the stem being longer).

Again, great review. It takes a lot of guts to invest money into an unknown, never seen before product, and I am glad you did. I bought some of these and will look it them myself.


Thanks! I got some more pics up. Unfortunately I don't have a small enough scale to measure the different weights. I will ask around and if I can find such a scale around these here parts I'll get some measurements and add them to the review :)
  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#5 tetsuhau

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 02:54 PM

Looks great! May pick some of these up. Can you try running them through a stryfe or RS? Interested on the result. If they really won't work without modification I may stick with koosh but if they do work it would be nice to run all suction cups.
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#6 ravetrooper

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 03:12 PM

Looks great! May pick some of these up. Can you try running them through a stryfe or RS? Interested on the result. If they really won't work without modification I may stick with koosh but if they do work it would be nice to run all suction cups.


In the video I briefly touch on what happened in my stryfe. The darts work just fine, the flywheels just shave the foam down towards the front at higher velocities because the darts are a little thicker than stock NERF darts. This doesn't ruin the darts or anything, but it can if you pull the trigger really slow.

Edited by ravetrooper, 24 February 2015 - 03:14 PM.

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Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#7 tetsuhau

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 03:37 PM

In the video I briefly touch on what happened in my stryfe. The darts work just fine, the flywheels just shave the foam down towards the front at higher velocities because the darts are a little thicker than stock NERF darts. This doesn't ruin the darts or anything, but it can if you pull the trigger really slow.


They fly accurately? There will be no issues with slow trigger pull in my RS :-D. Is there much variation in OD? They may work well for my foam spewing Vulcan. I know you said they might not work in all springers, but if one works will they all work?
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#8 ravetrooper

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 03:44 PM

They fly accurately? There will be no issues with slow trigger pull in my RS :-D. Is there much variation in OD? They may work well for my foam spewing Vulcan. I know you said they might not work in all springers, but if one works will they all work?


These are hands down the most accurate stock darts I've ever used. The OD is very consistent, I have yet to notice an odd dart out in the batch. I just tested a dart and it fit fine in my vulcan belt (barrel posts still in)

EDIT: the question is more if they work in stock elite blasters. The older n-strike blasters, like the vulcan, have shorter barrel posts and are more accepting to different kinds of ammo. NERF gave their new elite darts shorter dart tip stems and made the blaster's barrel posts longer so that you had to buy the new darts for the new guns. (Why streamlins won't fit in a stock strongarm barrel for example.)

Edited by ravetrooper, 24 February 2015 - 04:16 PM.

  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#9 Number 1 nerf nut

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Posted 03 March 2015 - 12:55 PM

If the darts are to long to work in nerf clips you could always just cut the foam back a little
P.S. I didn't know that about elites and the longer dart post, sneaky Hasbro
P.P.S. like the K.E.S. name
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Get Ready for Jesus, He is coming soon!


#10 ravetrooper

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Posted 03 March 2015 - 12:59 PM

If the darts are to long to work in nerf clips you could always just cut the foam back a little...


They fit great in all nerf containers I've tested. I have never had to chop any of them up. You could if you wanted, though. Who knows? Maybe it wil make them more awesome. Stick a weight in there and cut them down to stefan size and see what happens...

Edited by ravetrooper, 03 March 2015 - 01:04 PM.

  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#11 BlasterHacker

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Posted 03 March 2015 - 02:22 PM

Excellent excellent news. Thanks for recording so well! Everyone should do this always!!!

Edited by BlasterHacker, 03 March 2015 - 02:22 PM.

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#12 Blood Angel

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 05:51 AM

BLUF (Bottom Line Up Front): My batch came in and for the price, they are really good darts.

Posted Image

They are indeed 2.874 inches = 7.3 cm.

Posted Image

Posted Image

1.26g is above average for most stock darts and a .90g tip is about the same weight as koosh darts. Our groups has been calling them USCs (Universal Suction Clone), as the nerf brand elite clip compatible suction cup darts are called, "Universal Suction Darts" or USDs for short. Someone also liked the name "suction slugs" due to their shape. So far, they have fired out of all my elite blasters (both modded and stock). They perform just fine in flywheel, spring, and string propelled blasters (I don't have a stampede, sorry, but they seem to work well in the video the OP linked). They have the same problem with high velocity blasters with tight barrels, in that the suction cup tip folds back and gets stuck at velocities higher than 150fps. This occurs with both 9/16 brass and 19/32 brass.

I haven't done a chrono comparison or practical accuracy test (PAT) with them, yet (I'll get around to it). But from just playing around with them, I suspect near USD performance. Meaning, if your blaster shoots around 96.9fps with an Elite Streamline you will (probably) get around 103.8fps with these dart. And of course, the suction cup design means that the velocities drop rapidly the farther the dart travels. All-in-all a really good dart for the price. If your average engagement distance is less than 40ft, then these are worth considering over koosh. If you like to pot shot past 45ft, then you should stick to koosh.
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#13 ravetrooper

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 01:23 PM

BLUF (Bottom Line Up Front): My batch came in and for the price, they are really good darts.

They are indeed 2.874 inches = 7.3 cm.

1.26g is above average for most stock darts and a .90g tip is about the same weight as koosh darts. Our groups has been calling them USCs (Universal Suction Clone), as the nerf brand elite clip compatible suction cup darts are called, "Universal Suction Darts" or USDs for short. Someone also liked the name "suction slugs" due to their shape. So far, they have fired out of all my elite blasters (both modded and stock). They perform just fine in flywheel, spring, and string propelled blasters (I don't have a stampede, sorry, but they seem to work well in the video the OP linked). They have the same problem with high velocity blasters with tight barrels, in that the suction cup tip folds back and gets stuck at velocities higher than 150fps. This occurs with both 9/16 brass and 19/32 brass.

I haven't done a chrono comparison or practical accuracy test (PAT) with them, yet (I'll get around to it). But from just playing around with them, I suspect near USD performance. Meaning, if your blaster shoots around 96.9fps with an Elite Streamline you will (probably) get around 103.8fps with these dart. And of course, the suction cup design means that the velocities drop rapidly the farther the dart travels. All-in-all a really good dart for the price. If your average engagement distance is less than 40ft, then these are worth considering over koosh. If you like to pot shot past 45ft, then you should stick to koosh.


Thanks for the extra specs! It's good knowing they perform well for someone else too. I had a worry in the back of my mind that I had one lucky good batch and all the other ones were crap and everyone was going to get on here and hate and whatnot :P I also love the "USC" name idea. It immediately reminds me of "UFC" which means they might as well be called "kick butt darts" haha. The "suction slugs" name is great too! No one will want to get hit with them because they'll think you're shooting leeches or sommething... anyways, I added both names to the poll. Thanks for the ideas!

By the way, which seller did you buy these from? Was it the "select type" listing or the kind with the picture of the little orange buzz bee gun? Just want to know for reference of who actually sells the right/best darts.

Edited by ravetrooper, 08 March 2015 - 07:14 PM.

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Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#14 Blood Angel

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 05:50 PM

By the way, which seller did you buy these from? Was it the "select type" listing or the kind with the picture of the little orange buzz bee gun? Just want to know for reference of who actually sells the right/best darts.


I used the first "eforco: http://www.ebay.com/...=nerf&_sacat=0" link that you provided. It had the cheapest price for the #2 orange darts.
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#15 ravetrooper

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 06:09 PM

I used the first "eforco: http://www.ebay.com/...=nerf&_sacat=0" link that you provided. It had the cheapest price for the #2 orange darts.


Sweet! That confirms that they are in fact the same darts even though the picture in the listings varies. Thanks for the response :)
  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#16 Arvex

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Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:53 PM

This is very helpful. I'm ordering a pack of fifty to try out. If they work out, I'll buy more.

If barrel posts are an issue with my Elite blasters, I'm going to start trimming their barrel posts to the same length as classic N-strike blasters if I don't outright remove them.

EDIT: Regarding the poll. I want to put the idea forward of naming knockoff darts after the Nerfer who presented them first on the forums. (Bad idea, more of a joke)

Edited by Arvex, 09 March 2015 - 04:56 PM.

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#17 ravetrooper

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Posted 10 March 2015 - 11:24 PM

This is very helpful. I'm ordering a pack of fifty to try out. If they work out, I'll buy more.

If barrel posts are an issue with my Elite blasters, I'm going to start trimming their barrel posts to the same length as classic N-strike blasters if I don't outright remove them.

EDIT: Regarding the poll. I want to put the idea forward of naming knockoff darts after the Nerfer who presented them first on the forums. (Bad idea, more of a joke)


Barrel post removal is always the first mod for any blaster I get. As for the naming idea, I already put that forward ;)
  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#18 Number 1 nerf nut

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Posted 16 March 2015 - 05:36 PM

I was looking at the pictures and the eforco dart heads seem to have a smaller diameter than the original darts that rave trooper bought,so they might not get stuck on the barrel extentions of guns,by the way love the Universal Suction Darts name (AWESOME!) :D
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1 Peter 2:24 "Who His own self bare our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed."

Get Ready for Jesus, He is coming soon!


#19 Keska

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Posted 21 March 2015 - 08:54 PM

I just got in a 50-pack that I ordered from eboxoon. I was hoping they would fit in my Impact X blaster, or if not, then I could cut them down to fit - since at $3.50 for 50 of them I wouldn't feel too bad about it. They took a full month to arrive, but they were in good condition.

It turns out that if you snip off the suction cups they are just the right size to fit. The range (25' - the longest hallway in my house) and accuracy were quite good.
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#20 tetsuhau

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 09:43 PM

Sorry to dig up an old post. Any one know where I can get some of these faster than a month away?
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#21 Griever 2112

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 03:03 PM

Don't know, but honestly I don't recommend them. I got 10 with a Blazestorm, and they are terrible. Better off buying the Koosh darts. Better dart and quality.
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#22 Snoop Doggy doge

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 05:48 PM

I just got mine in the mail, they're shorter than normal lol, but they do fine for me. Maybe your batch is bad Griever?
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#23 ravetrooper

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 07:24 PM

Don't know, but honestly I don't recommend them. I got 10 with a Blazestorm, and they are terrible. Better off buying the Koosh darts. Better dart and quality.


I believe the one that come with some of those knock-off blasters are actually a different brand/type. There are also some I found that have a moee rubbery-looking tip, but I haven't bought any to review; these havebeen working great for me even months after my original review.
  • 0

Gut the electronics, drill a hole in the shell, and attach a crank to the gear. Bam, crank-action stampede that doesn't require batteries, or even a trigger.

...(also judging by your past posts, I would consider you pretty dang wise elder like in the modding community :lol: )


#24 Griever 2112

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 10:09 AM

I just got mine in the mail, they're shorter than normal lol, but they do fine for me. Maybe your batch is bad Griever?


The Elite knockoff and the suction cup ones are both shorter than the standard elites. But the ones I got with the blazestorm just honestly didn't impress me. I am of the consensus that the Koosh Darts are the better alternative to the official darts... plus the ones I got if you really are just looking for suction cup darts. the cup is self is very thin, and the base is hard plastic... again in the batch I got... but since they are visually very similar, I don't think they are going to have much of a variance in design and quality between sellers.
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Griever 2112 still plays with his alpha trooper quite often despite owning one of the scariest +bows.

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#25 Heatblast016

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Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:54 PM

Thx- I might buy these if I find regular elite suctions good
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