13 replies to this topic

[uranium]

As the title says, I am trying to find what voltage works best with the NSR Shark 40K slot car motors. The two voltages that I am looking at are 11.1V or 14.4V as I plan on using a LiPo battery pack to power the blaster. This is the third flywheel blaster that I am modifying, but the first one that I am looking at running more than a 2s LiPo battery pack in. My first modification was to a Rapidstrike using two Blade 180 Extreme motors and I have had very good results. My second flywheel mod was using a Stryfe, but I only did minimal mods (Rewire with 16 gauge wire and removal of locks) when I added the LiPo battery.

I am wanting to use the NSR 40k Shark motors on this blaster to try something a little different while also keeping the shell intact. I will be adding diodes to induce a voltage drop to the pusher motor to control firing speed, and may at a later date play with a fire selector switch to control the rate of fire.

I will try to add some pictures of the modded Rapidstrike and Stryfe late tonight, but be forewarned that the RS underwent a very bad hack job being that it was my first mod ever and I was more interested in getting the thing working than the looks. Thanks in advance for the help.

[meishel]

I did a quick google search and found multiple sites listing those motors and the voltage they require. http://www.powerslot...-Can-p/3005.htm

They run 40k RPM @ 12 volts, but will go faster with more voltage. I may be corrected on this, but I thought after 25k or 30k RPM, torque was more beneficial than more RPM.

[RedFear]

if this is a single stage motor setup, torque is more important. if it's a multi-stage flywheel blaster, RPM is more desirable on the front sets and torque on the rear sets (as you move further towards the front of the blaster, less torque emphasis is needed and more rpm emphasis is needed.)

I think you'll do fine with 11.1v lipo, just make sure not to burn the motors as high rpm creates lots of heat. get a heatsink and fan if it overheats a lot.

[uranium]

meishel, I have not yet read about the RPM ceiling yet, but what you said does make sense. I think that I might end up going with a set of NSR 3028 motors that have more torque than the Sharks that I listed in my first post, but I still need to weigh if I want to cut the shell again....I was really wanting a stock looking blaster with amazing power

RedFear, This will be a single stage system so I will be needing the torque as you and meishel stated. I was hoping though that you might have more information on adding heat sinks to these motors. The heat sinks that I have looked up all seem to jsut attach to the outer shell of the motor. I am guessing that this is the only for them to go to get the additional cooling that is needed, but if there is another way to force cool these motors, or a different heat sink design, I am open to all suggestions.

As I am still a FNG, this unfortunately will be my last post for the day (unless I get lucky and a Mod allows me bypass that) which means that I won't get to respond or upload any pictures until tomorrow, however, I will be lurking around the rest of the site and watching this thread. Thanks again for the help.

[jwasko]

I think shark 40s usually take 3S (11.1V) lipos. Source: https://blastersmith...tch-upgrade-kit

Another alternative for a stock-ish blaster would be tamiya motors. A lot of people have gone for Plasma Dashes, but I've also heard good things about Tamiya Torque Tuned. All the tamiyas run on 1S (3.7V) lipos.

Edited by jwasko, 05 January 2015 - 06:53 PM.

[Zombona]

Another alternative for a stock-ish blaster would be tamiya motors. A lot of people have gone for Plasma Dashes, but I've also heard good things about Tamiya Torque Tuned. All the tamiyas run on 1S (3.7V) lipos.

I have used both and will likely continue to use both. They are great little motors. The decreased voltage requirements means you can hide battery packs better. I usually run mine on 2.4V NiMH packs, but have a 3.6V pack for fun.

[uranium]

Zombona, I looked up the specs for the Tamiya motors and all of them only recommend a voltage of between 2.4V and 3.0V. I would like to stay LiPo which would basically mean overvolting those motors by about a third with a fully charged LiPo. How have your motors held up to the 3.6V battery pack? The Tamiya motors look to be a good upgrade compared to the stock motors, but a step down from the NSR Shark 40k motors (which is not a bad thing considering the step down in price of 50% to 75%).

As promised, below is the picture of my two modded blasters.



The RS is so much fun to mess around with. I am still needing to make a covering for the motors before I start banging it around, but for just range tests and rate of fire test it is awesome. The sound alone from the motors is a little freaky for a Nerf blaster and pretty much negate ever being able to sneak up on someone. I keep going back and forth on whether to get another battery pack that fits inside the shell, or just leave that beautiful duct tape work for the whole world to see.

The Stryfe is a little disappointing after seeing what the RS can do. It's just stock motors for now with a 16 gauge rewire and the LiPo pack installed. The Stryfe is still much better now than it was in stock form, but I would say 75% of that is from the removal of the locking system that keeps the trigger from being pulled if a dart isn't present in the magazine (I was having to hit the bottom of the magazine between each shot just to get it to fire before I took that lock out).

Now to just figure out what motor to buy for this next mod

Edit: Corrected spelling.

Edited by uranium, 07 January 2015 - 12:50 PM.

[J-Andy]

I get that you wanna keep your shell in tact but according to my reading, which is not personal experience, it is my understanding that NSR Shark 40's or any other 130 size can isn't going to last very long if you plan to run 3S (they will get amazingly hot and munch down brushes). I am working on an RS right now and have tried to read just about everything I can because my budget is only $300 and I hope to create something reliable and not waste $$ wishing I had went another route. If you are set on a 130 size can then your best bet is probably gonna be the shark 40's. BSUK makes nice 3D printed 180 motor covers if you want to run 180's but keep a clean look.

[Zombona]

Zoomba, I looked up the specs for the Tamiya motors and all of them only recommend a voltage of between 2.4V and 3.0V. I would like to stay LiPo which would basically mean overvolting those motors by about a third with a fully charged LiPo. How have your motors held up to the 3.6V battery pack? The Tamiya motors look to be a good upgrade compared to the stock motors, but a step down from the NSR Shark 40k motors (which is not a bad thing considering the step down in price of 50% to 75%).

Tamiya motors have held up quite well for me so far. The first set of motors have been in use for over a year and are still going strong (Hyper-dash JR). My favorite ones to use on Flywheels are Torque Tuned and for pushers I use Plasma Dash's. My main sell for them however is the ability to use smaller/simpler battery packs. If you want motors that will last longer than the blaster then you should check out some Mabuchi FK-180SH-3240 and run them at 2S.

Also Zoomba =/= Zombona.

my budget is only $300

Only $300...I think you will be more than ok with that kind of build budget.

[uranium]

I did check out the FK-180SH-3240 motors and they seem like another good upgrade option, especially with the carbon brushes. I will most likely go with those for a stockish/cheaper modded blaster for messing around at stock type events. I have already ordered three of those motors to use as pushers in my two current Rapidstrikes.

In regards to budget for upgrading an Rapidstrike, the following is the parts price breakdown for my first mod attempt:

Motors: $28.50 (matched pair of Blade Xtreme 180 Pro motors from ebay)
Rev Switch: $4 (Microswitch from Radioshack)
Wire: ~$3 (Total for 3 spools of 18 gauge from Radioshack was $21, but that was for 25' spools and that's enough to do at least 7 blasters. For a better price just go to Lowe's)
Solder: ~$0.25 (Just a guess as there is very little used and solder costs around $2 a spool on Amazon)
Battery Charger: $8 (Neweer B3 LiPo 2s-3s charger on Amazon)
Battery: $30 (Racer's Edge 2800mAh, 25C hard case battery on Amazon. This is your most variable cost besides the motors)
Battery Volt Meter/Alarm: $3 (Standard 1s-8s battery voltage alarm on Amazon)
Duct Tape: $0 (Everyone should have duct tape laying around.)
Deans Plugs: $0.30 (Get 10 for $3 on Amazon)
Heat Shrink: ~$0.50 ($6 on Amazon for a 48 piece package)
Soldering Iron: $8 (60 watt soldering iron from any online shop)


Time to complete the project and realization that you just spent over $100 on a nerf blaster that kills darts....sadness that goes away after the battery is charged and the first dart goes down range.

[J-Andy]

I am pretty much going the same route just some minor differences

x2 xtreme pro 180's
xtreme pro silver bushes
Pololu 9V 2.5A stepdown regulator (for the pusher)
Zippy compact 2200mah 40C 3S
Hobby King voltage / cell checker / alarm
24" 3S balance lead extension
BSUK RS wiring and switch upgrade
BSUK RS 180 motor cover
Maybe a Burst Wizard wired in on the pusher for burst fire (not sure yet if this is possible)
Picatinny rails
Red dot reflex sight
Folding front grip
25 round drum
Montacical stencils
paints, brushes, etc etc

The painting crap is eating a good portion of my budget $35 for stencils, $45 for airbrush paint and thinner, scotchbrites, sandpaper, tape blah, blah, blah. Working on a Demo 2 in 1 also (which will actually run sharks because I purchased them before I knew better so may as well run em till they're roasted). Fun stuff.

Edited by J-Andy, 08 January 2015 - 01:38 AM.

[uranium]

That is quite a parts list and I can now see why you are worried about your $300 budget. Two pieces in your build sheet caught my eye, the Pololu stepdown regulator and the Burst Wizard. The Burst Wizard seems like a nice all in one fire control unit, but couldn't the same thing be accomplished by using some electronic timers and setting the correct time delay to a relay for the pusher motor? It would take some additional work, but it would be a very simple system to duplicate once designed. With the stepdown regulator, are you going to be able to cool it enough to maintain the 9V that you want to send to the pusher motor? Also, what pusher motor are you planning on using? The stepdown regulator appears to have a voltage rise that goes from 9V to 10.8V as current rises from 0 to 2.5 amps.

The rest of your build seems really nice and I would like to see the finished product as I am curious as to how the flywheel motors are going to handle the increased voltage.

P.S. Do you have a link tot he BSUK switch upgrade kit and motor cover? I haven't been able to find those pieces with the prices included yet. Thanks.

[Zombona]

P.S. Do you have a link tot he BSUK switch upgrade kit and motor cover? I haven't been able to find those pieces with the prices included yet. Thanks.

That wasn't so hard.

I've got a pair of Xtreme 180s right now and I run them at 2S voltages. My advice is try yours at 2S so you know how scary they are before you decide to go with a 3S.

[J-Andy]

That is quite a parts list and I can now see why you are worried about your $300 budget. Two pieces in your build sheet caught my eye, the Pololu stepdown regulator and the Burst Wizard. The Burst Wizard seems like a nice all in one fire control unit, but couldn't the same thing be accomplished by using some electronic timers and setting the correct time delay to a relay for the pusher motor? It would take some additional work, but it would be a very simple system to duplicate once designed. With the stepdown regulator, are you going to be able to cool it enough to maintain the 9V that you want to send to the pusher motor? Also, what pusher motor are you planning on using? The stepdown regulator appears to have a voltage rise that goes from 9V to 10.8V as current rises from 0 to 2.5 amps.

The rest of your build seems really nice and I would like to see the finished product as I am curious as to how the flywheel motors are going to handle the increased voltage.

P.S. Do you have a link tot he BSUK switch upgrade kit and motor cover? I haven't been able to find those pieces with the prices included yet. Thanks.

I am hoping the regulator will be satisfactory without any additional cooling. It wont be receiving consistent current, only when the pusher is initiated. Then again I really have no idea. I haven't the slightest clue when it comes to electronics. I read a blog or something where someone tried a similar set up using a 7.5v 2.5A stepdown regulator with success so I figured I would give it a try.

As for the burst wizard... if this is even possible I am only doing it for simplicity sake. It is easier for me to dish out a few additional dollars than to pretend I know what I am doing and buy a bunch of electronics thing-a-majiggies and try to make them work. That would just be a waste of time and money for me. BSUK is working on a plug and play select fire unit but the last time I checked it was still going to be a few months before these are available. I don't need a billion options, I just want 3 or 5 round burst.

As for the pusher motor I haven't made up my mind yet. I have a bunch of 130's. I may see how well an RM2 holds up and if it fails I may try an NSR 130. I doubt I run a 180 on the pusher unless I absolutely must. I have portioned some of budget for trial and error lol.

@Zombona I have already ordered the 3S. If it becomes too much of a hassle it wont be a waste as we have a slew of Traxxas VXL's. Unfortunately all of the 6400mah 3S batteries we had were just a couple mm too big. This is mainly just for fun anyhow, we don't do HvZ or wars and I don't plan to pepper anyone down with this unit... just wanna see what we can make happen and spend some time with my son while we are trapped indoors for the winter.