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Need Help Identifying Gun

Got it for $2.50, and I think its worth more than that...

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#1 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 02:01 PM

Okay, so I picked out two of these at a vintage toy sale yesterday for $3 each, or 2 for $5. I think they are Super Soaker 50's, but all of the ones that I've seen come in a box like this...
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However, mine looks quite a bit different, and suspicious. My box looks like this...
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My question is: Is this gun worth the same amount as the others? (they were going for around $75-100 NIB)
Also, what brand is it? There is no branding what-so-ever on the box.
Any help would be great! Here are some more pics of the gun's box (I don't want to take it out).
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#2 Chadpuff

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 03:00 PM

I think it is just a knock off. I can't really tell without seeing pictures of the actual water gun but judging from the picture on the box it appears to use the same mold as the original.

Edited by Chadpuff, 25 August 2012 - 03:04 PM.

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#3 mysterio

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 03:04 PM

They appear to be ripoffs of the SS50, but a check for the manufacturer could prove this.
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If two powerful is a problem then just go with one powerful. I guess this style of hopper will work even beyond three powerful..


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#4 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 03:06 PM

I think It is just a knock off.

Thats what I thought too, but then I opened one of the boxes, and the sticker was the exact same as the one on the tank of the "real" one...
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#5 mysterio

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 03:09 PM

Check for a manufacturer on the box?
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If two powerful is a problem then just go with one powerful. I guess this style of hopper will work even beyond three powerful..


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#6 MavericK96

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 04:18 PM

I used to have two Super Soaker 50s. Those are knock-offs for sure.
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#7 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 04:47 PM

No, no trademarks or manufacturer on the box, also, just realized that the stickers are not the same...does anyone still think that it could be worth anything?

Edited by bhajj94, 25 August 2012 - 05:31 PM.

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#8 Righteous Fondue

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 05:44 PM

Post a thread in trading and let people make offers
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They don't think it be like it is, but it do.

#9 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 05:50 PM

Post a thread in trading and let people make offers

Okay, Ill think about that. However, now that I am pretty sure that they are fake, I'm doing an expanded hornet mod on it, on one, and I'll try to sell the other one. Thanks for everyone's help, really appreciated.
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#10 DX-Robert

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 09:50 PM

I've never heard of this version and it's likely that the packaging is a knock-off, but that the model is real. It's not American, you can tell by how the stats are given in metric first. The stats are also an almost exact match with the real MK1 - 340 grams weight, 49.5 cm length, range in the low 30s. The genuine MK1 is marked with 50ft, which it never achieves, but is a reliable identifier box-wise. The only way to know for sure is to open one of them and compare against the a real one. Like I said before, it's probably a genuine SS 50 that got re-boxed and re-marketed. It's circumspect if there's no brand or maker on the box anywhere.

It would likely be worth more if it's not an actual SS 50, because the SS 50 is a mediocre soaker in performance. It was the king of its era, but is now only a notch above the Nerf Super Soaker series. Hasbro has actually started making piston trigger designs again, in essence regressing all the way back to the 50, and beyond that with their battery powered models. Water gun value is heavily dependent on how powerful the gun is, not just how rare it is. You may have something that is extremely rare, and thus may be able to fetch a good amount if you can find the right collector. That is the key to these kinds of things, where the model is unique, but lacks performance. I'm not sure if here or Ebay are the right places to list it. You need to find a person who doesn't care if it sucks or even still works. I can refer you to a couple people who might be interested in buying that, but you'll have to be willing to ship internationally and/or be willing to negotiate with very informed collectors. We're not the same people who go nuts on Ebay, nobody knows who they are.

Be really careful if you go the Ebay route, because you have to know 100% if it's genuine or not before choosing keywords and writing a description. If it's not Larami-boxed, you can't call it an SS 50 even if that's what it turns out to be inside the box, unless you sell it without the box. We go on there and look for fake soakers to report daily - some models are worth so much that it's painful to watch all those poor n00b bidders get ripped off.

So, your find is definitely cool, and definitely worth further discussion. I'm not sure if it's worth money without seeing what's inside.
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#11 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 10:13 PM

I've never heard of this version and it's likely that the packaging is a knock-off, but that the model is real. It's not American, you can tell by how the stats are given in metric first. The stats are also an almost exact match with the real MK1 - 340 grams weight, 49.5 cm length, range in the low 30s. The genuine MK1 is marked with 50ft, which it never achieves, but is a reliable identifier box-wise. The only way to know for sure is to open one of them and compare against the a real one. Like I said before, it's probably a genuine SS 50 that got re-boxed and re-marketed. It's circumspect if there's no brand or maker on the box anywhere.

It would likely be worth more if it's not an actual SS 50, because the SS 50 is a mediocre soaker in performance. It was the king of its era, but is now only a notch above the Nerf Super Soaker series. Hasbro has actually started making piston trigger designs again, in essence regressing all the way back to the 50, and beyond that with their battery powered models. Water gun value is heavily dependent on how powerful the gun is, not just how rare it is. You may have something that is extremely rare, and thus may be able to fetch a good amount if you can find the right collector. That is the key to these kinds of things, where the model is unique, but lacks performance. I'm not sure if here or Ebay are the right places to list it. You need to find a person who doesn't care if it sucks or even still works. I can refer you to a couple people who might be interested in buying that, but you'll have to be willing to ship internationally and/or be willing to negotiate with very informed collectors. We're not the same people who go nuts on Ebay, nobody knows who they are.

Be really careful if you go the Ebay route, because you have to know 100% if it's genuine or not before choosing keywords and writing a description. If it's not Larami-boxed, you can't call it an SS 50 even if that's what it turns out to be inside the box, unless you sell it without the box. We go on there and look for fake soakers to report daily - some models are worth so much that it's painful to watch all those poor n00b bidders get ripped off.

So, your find is definitely cool, and definitely worth further discussion. I'm not sure if it's worth money without seeing what's inside.

I opened one of them up, and modded it before you commented, thinking that it was fake. However, I took some pics of it before I modded it. One of the most interesting things is that the handle is detachable, and Im not sure if this confirms any suspicions (making it real or fake).
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Close-up of tank
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Trigger design also seems to be different than one pictured on top. I opened it up and it uses no springs at all. It is a black, metal piece that pushes it down, and there is a tube that goes under it. When the trigger is pulled, a pin comes off of the tubing, letting the air come out. Unfortunately, I didn't get any pics of this before modding it, and I cannot replicate it to show how it worked. Also, it shoots a good 30 ft (advertised on the box).
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I am willing to ship internationally, if we can get that far and if the item is truly an Mk1.
Thanks for your input!
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#12 DX-Robert

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 11:15 PM

Yeah, the original SS line used "pinches" for trigger design. It was not a smart move to mod this unless you convert the trigger system to a pull or ball valve. If you keep the pinch, it's going to fail. Pinch triggers fail by design because the tube is cinched shut when the trigger is at rest. Since it's always at rest when not in use, over time this weakens the ability of the tubing to reopen and eventually it won't. The tubing can be replaced, but that's just a temporary fix.

The detachable handle is a first. However, the rest of the gun appears to be a perfect match, especially how it uses a pinch trigger. From that, I'm more inclined to believe that it is a European version and a second version of the original. Worth more than any MK1 if the internals are a perfect match as I now believe them to be. Do you have a pic of the full internals?
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#13 bhajj94

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 11:25 PM

Yeah, the original SS line used "pinches" for trigger design. It was not a smart move to mod this unless you convert the trigger system to a pull or ball valve. If you keep the pinch, it's going to fail. Pinch triggers fail by design because the tube is cinched shut when the trigger is at rest. Since it's always at rest when not in use, over time this weakens the ability of the tubing to reopen and eventually it won't. The tubing can be replaced, but that's just a temporary fix.

The detachable handle is a first. However, the rest of the gun appears to be a perfect match, especially how it uses a pinch trigger. From that, I'm more inclined to believe that it is a European version and a second version of the original. Worth more than any MK1 if the internals are a perfect match as I now believe them to be. Do you have a pic of the full internals?

I cannot get a pic of the full internals, unless I unbox the one, and cut off the orange ring on the back, which I dont want to do. I was too stupid to take a pic before modding it. (I used an expanded hornet tank & blast button)
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#14 ferball

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 11:51 AM

I am guessing that it is the exact same gun as the Super Soaker 50. It was probably sold "after market". When Super Soaker was done selling that model the factory they came out of may have over produced in anticipation of orders. So when the orders stopped coming the surplus was sold to a third party who repackaged them as the "Air Water Gun". Just a guess though.
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#15 Langley

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 12:08 PM

Moved to off topic, because it's a freaking water gun. Doom and DX are both soaker fanaticks, you should probably just PM them. Or ask Shandsgator8, since he appears in the box art.

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#16 mcaustin1

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 05:36 PM

Posted Image~-Content Deleted-~Posted Image


Edited by mcaustin1, 10 September 2012 - 06:01 PM.
removed quote of entire first post.

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#17 Blue

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 09:31 PM

http://i1249.photobu...94/129_0045.jpg

Has any one else noticed that the "SUPER SOAKER" words have clearly been taped over? Obviously this thing violated trademarks and is a complete knockoff.
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#18 DX-Robert

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 10:40 PM

We had a lot of Skype discussion about this and determined that it's most likely a genuine model that an overseas company got ahold of, wiped, and resold as its property. The actual contents, externally and internally, are genuine, and the stats/specs are an exact match with the real SS 50. The grip detaches, which is a previously unknown factory modification, but agan, when assembled its dimensions are an exact match with the usual grip. Every trademark, copyright, etc has been wiped - even the text printed in the plastic is gone.

So basically, it is not a real SS 50 and it is also not counterfeit or a knock off. It's a legit gun in an illegit presentation, neither real nor fake. At the end of the day, it still has the performance of an SS 50, which sucks. A very small handful of hardcore collectors (3) may see value beyond that of an ordinary SS 50 because of this one's uniqueness, brand intrique, and possible backstory. The rest of us just see an SS 50.
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