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Nerf Pistol


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#1 Ginjiroku

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 06:22 PM

Last night I was bored and drew up some plans for a PVC nerf pistol. Now I'm thinking of making one and once I make a few and work out some of the possible problems I'll post pics and stuff. It works like a paintball marker becuase while I was working on the plans I was staring at an animated gif of the internals of a PGP. I'm also thinking of selling them if the project is succesful.
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#2 Vintage

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 06:47 PM

Can you give us any idea as to how it will work. I might be able to help you work through some of your problems.

~Vintage
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#3 Ginjiroku

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 06:51 PM

I'll probably be able to sort out the problems. I won't be able to start for a little while and making the first one will take a while. Also if the results are good would you be interested at one as a sidearm?

Edited by Ginjiroku, 20 April 2004 - 06:51 PM.

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#4 Vintage

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 06:53 PM

I suppose you don't want to leak your plans yet. That's ok, but I was hoping you could at least try to explain how it works. Pistols are hard to make, because you are dealing with smaller dimensions.

If you don't want to describe how it works, then I can't really tell if it will turn out ok.

~Vintage
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#5 Ginjiroku

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 06:58 PM

Well it would take way too long to explain it and the only plans I have are really poorly drawn and I can't scan them. I need to make some neater plans to exact scale. On top of that I really don't want to leak the plans right now.
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#6 Formerly Sane

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Posted 22 April 2004 - 09:27 PM

...I'm also thinking of selling them if the project is succesful.

How about you stop thinking about selling them... and don't sell them. Just post the plans like everyone else. Most people won't bother spending their time on it and if they do, you'll get credit for it. Zero doesn't sell his valve designs for money, he sells them in exchange for respect. I'd advise you to do the same and hit paint for a few minutes.

Since I don't really feel like starting a thread about this, I thought up an okay design for a five way barrel switching system. Basically, its just a piece of pvc about 6 inches long. One half has four holes drilled in the bottom and is closed at the end. Vinyl(sp?) tubing leads from these holes to the barrels. Now a piece of brass fitting the pvc tightly is also closed at one end and one hole is drilled at the bottom of it at that end. The brass is then slid into the pvc. The air from the blaster is propelled into the brass, to the end of it and down to one of the four holes aligned with the opening in the brass. The air then reaches the barrel. The only obvious problem is air leakage in between the two holes. To avoid having another semi auto valve and losing power that way, I would just us this as an alternative to reloading or possibly put it on a spring gun.

Hope you post more about the pistol. I'm interested as to its design.

ps. Is it CO2 powered or compressed air?
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#7 Vintage

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Posted 22 April 2004 - 09:44 PM

I like your idea Formerly Sane. I understand what you are talking about.

1. I think what you would need is brass that is really loose in the pvc.

2. Then glue a foam sheet around the brass to seal it against the pvc.

3. Add the hole in the brass through the foam

4. Drill a hole in the pvc endcap.

5. Add a turning rod to the end of the brass poking out the endcap hole

You then turn the protruding rod to the alternate barrel holes. Keep thinking along this idea. If you want a 3d render of my vision of your idea tell me.

~Vintage
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#8 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 08:43 PM

Ok so I won't sell them becuase you're right that is selfish. Anyway I did some blueprints in paint. Now It's not big enough to show were the o-rings are but trust me every place that needs to be is sealed. Another thing these are just plans. Building it may be next to impossible but I'm still going to try. In the drawing none of the parts are reletive in size I just kind of guessed so I could show the design. And it aso really sucks becuase It's paint.

Link to the image!
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#9 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 08:51 PM

Sorry, I can't understand the picture. The image is cropped, so many of the lines are missing, and the whole thing is in BMP format. It took awhile to load. Maybe you could convert the original drawing to JPG format (Choose "Save-As" in Paint, then choose the JPEG extension).

That way you could leave the image in its original size, and it will load much quicker.

Thanks,

~Vintage

Edit:
Ok, I saved the image to my hard-drive and opened it up there. I can see it clearly now.

It looks like the trigger releases the plunger which knocks the valve open to release the air.

I really like the concept, although the way it's on paper now, the air pressure alone will press up against the closed valve opening it up itself.

I will work on this idea and see what I can come up with on paper myself. I'll get back to you.

~Vintage

Edited by Vintage, 23 April 2004 - 08:57 PM.

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#10 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:06 PM

It's a big pic and IE resizes pics. I kept it in BMP becuase JPEG blurs. I should have saved it as a gif though. Anyway yea you need a really strong valve spring. The stronger the spring the more pressure it can withstand. And the main spring behind the hammer needs to be slightly softer but just slightly so after the hammer strikes the valve spring can push it back. That circle in the hammer is a rod that goes through a slit in the mainbody so you can reset the hammer.
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#11 cxwq

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:19 PM

Ok so I won't sell them becuase you're right that is selfish.

I disagree.

Post details of what you've done. If it's good, a few people will duplicate your work. If it's really good, they'll tell everyone how great it is - something that you could never convince people of on your own. Those who want one but have no clue how to pick up a tool will ask you if they can buy one.

In case anyone missed it, the steps are:

1. Give to the community

2. Get respect

3. Profit!
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<meta name="cxwq" content="mostly water">

#12 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:24 PM

Ok so I won't sell them becuase you're right that is selfish.

I disagree.

Post details of what you've done. If it's good, a few people will duplicate your work. If it's really good, they'll tell everyone how great it is - something that you could never convince people of on your own. Those who want one but have no clue how to pick up a tool will ask you if they can buy one.

In case anyone missed it, the steps are:

1. Give to the community

2. Get respect

3. Profit!

Yea I was thinking of still offering them for sale and then also offering the plans to people that are up to building it.

Phase I: Collect Underpants

Phase II: ???

Phase III: Profit!

I just had to add that ;)
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#13 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:32 PM

Ok, your idea put me off on a tangent of pistol building. Though your idea is interesting, I thought maybe a simpler route might be found. (In your design, you have to pump it, AND cock the plunger thing)

Here's the diagram I just worked up:

Posted Image

The concept would work, I just haven't put time into drawing up a working model with parts needed, etc.

If there are flaws, tell me, I only put about 5 minutes into the drawing

~Vintage

Edit: By all means, sell it if you make one that works. I just meant that I can help you with your designs if you need it.

Edited by Vintage, 23 April 2004 - 09:34 PM.

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#14 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:35 PM

It's a great idea. I'll draw up plans for a simple pistol.

Edited by Ginjiroku, 23 April 2004 - 09:36 PM.

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#15 Formerly Sane

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:46 PM

Vintage's design looks very simple, and simplicity often proves effective in battle. Ginjiroko, your design is very very complex, but good job with all the internals. In other words, it would work well but theres a whole lot of empty or wasted space. I do like your simple auto valve in front of and above the trigger. I think putting that right after the zero valve in Vintage's concept and expanding the air tank could provide for a nice multi shot pistol. Bit more bulky though.
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#16 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:49 PM

Ok, I put about another 5 minutes into my drawing, in order to put as much simplicity as possible, and to add a flashy exterior :P

Here it is:

Posted Image

What do you think?

~Vintage
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#17 Ice Nine

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 09:58 PM

Okay.

How do you pressureize it? It would be cool to use Co2, but if you only used a bike pump or something, that would work. It wouldn't take very many pumps anyway, because it has a small airtank.
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#18 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:01 PM

Vintage's design looks very simple, and simplicity often proves effective in battle. Ginjiroko, your design is very very complex, but good job with all the internals. In other words, it would work well but theres a whole lot of empty or wasted space. I do like your simple auto valve in front of and above the trigger. I think putting that right after the zero valve in Vintage's concept and expanding the air tank could provide for a nice multi shot pistol. Bit more bulky though.

Why my ideas are so complex are because I paintball a whole lot more than I nerf. So my designs are paintball inspired and very complicated. I'm working on a simple breech load design with room for a mag.
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#19 Formerly Sane

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:11 PM

Vintage, you just lost me about $30 to pvc. I have to build one of those now! I still think that an auto valve could be added in the upper right hand corner of your design. Basically, the air would come into that small chamber and hit a pice or pvc with an O-ring around it. This piece of pvc would be forced toward the direction of the dart and compress a spring until a piece of vinyl tube is exposed. This tube leads up and over the small wall in the picture to behind the dart and fires it. If the trigger was held down, the gun would fire about 3 or 4 times, I'll estimate, before it ran out of air.

An auto pistol isn't what we're looking for though. This valve would only insure that not all the air was released in one shot, and without the use of a manual reserve tank. A manual reserve tank where you open one valve and then another to fire the gun might be more effective at getting a larger amount of air to the dart, but it would take longer.

Over all, if I make this I'll probably experiment with some other valve in the top part of the gun, but if I have a quick trigger finger it shouldn't be a problem. Nice job.

<edit>Ginjiroku, we don't mean to be stealing your thunder so keep designing and building. :P

Edited by Formerly Sane, 23 April 2004 - 10:12 PM.

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#20 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:12 PM

How do you pressureize it?

I really hadn't thought about that, yet. I suppose I could rip out the pump for my SSPB. It could be sealed in the under-the-barrel airtank.

It would be much cooler than an SSPB, with much more firepower due to the larger airtank, and the ability of PVC to hold more pressure.

~Vintage

Edit: Sorry about your $30 loss Formerly Sane. Somehow I think it wont be THAT expensive, mostly precise cutting.

Edit:

I still think that an auto valve could be added in the upper right hand corner of your design. Basically, the air would come into that small chamber and hit a pice or pvc with an O-ring around it. This piece of pvc would be forced toward the direction of the dart and compress a spring until a piece of vinyl tube is exposed. This tube leads up and over the small wall in the picture to behind the dart and fires it. If the trigger was held down, the gun would fire about 3 or 4 times, I'll estimate, before it ran out of air.


I know what you are talking about, and here it is:

Posted Image

Edited by Vintage, 23 April 2004 - 10:29 PM.

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#21 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:36 PM

I love that style auto valve. I made and animation of it.
Posted Image

Anyway I'm still working on a different design for a pistol. It's not necessarly any more simple in how it works but it will be alot easyer to build.

Edited by Ginjiroku, 23 April 2004 - 10:45 PM.

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#22 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:44 PM

That animation makes my head spin :P That idea, like I said in a previous thread, won't really work too well. (Even though I showed it in my last pistol design)

I think what it will do, is release a very rapid succession of bursts of air. Way too fast for nerf darts to launch one-by-one.

Here's where the concept goes wrong:

1. Air compresses spring
2. Air is released when piston reaches valve opening
3. Spring starts to cycle the piston back to former state, while more air is pumped into chamber.
4. Air starts compressing spring again before spring reaches former state.

So, I think the piston will definitely not ever make a full back and forth cycle. It will really make quick "half-clycles."

~Vintage
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#23 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:54 PM

It depends on the strength of the spring. It actually fires quite slow. My friend (bobert) made one.
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#24 Vintage

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 10:59 PM

It actually fires quite slow.

Cool, I might have to try it. I was afraid it wouldn't cycle completely, thereby eliminating the possibility for a magazine.
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#25 Ginjiroku

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Posted 23 April 2004 - 11:03 PM

It won't reach it's starting point ever but with a strong enough spring it will get close.
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