28 replies to this topic

[Langley]

http://www.neowin.ne...9&category=main

Neowin has learned of shocking and potentially devastating news. It would appear that two packages are circulating on the internet, one being the source code to Windows 2000, and the other being the source code to Windows NT. At this time, it is hard to establish whether or not full code has leaked, and this will undoubtedly remain the situation until an attempt is made to compile them. Microsoft are currently unavailable for comment surrounding this leak so we have no official response from them at the time of writing.

This leak is a shock not only to Neowin, but to the wider IT industry. The ramifications of this leak are far reaching and devastating. This reporter does not wish to be sensationalist, but the number of industries and critical systems that are based around these technologies that could be damaged by new exploits found in this source code is something that doesn't bare thinking about.

This is either incredibly good news, or incredibly bad news, depending on what side of the fence you're on. I'm just glad I'm not a Sys Admin for any large companies.

[Nerfer16]

This should be BAD news for everyone (Except for hackers)

[Spectre2689]

It's also very GOOD news for Microsoft haters, such as myself. So many problems lately, when the hell are they going to die? Then I could actually run games on Linux, so I could install it. Until then I'm stuck with WinXP. Did anyone hear about the 'critical' security leak in all of the OS's? Yeah, supposedly eEye found a HUGE security leak, and was told by Microsoft to keep their mouthes shut about it. 6 MONTHS later, they came out with a fix for it. SIX MONTHS. What the fuck is that?! I know like five people who got their computers owned because of that security leak.

[Black Wrath]

Yeah good news I guess. I hate Microsoft. Now we get to go from a multi-coloured butterfly, to a gay penguin. What the hell? I personally don't like either OS, Windows or Linux, nor do I like Macs. I'm picky... but hey, as long as it works, and it plays any game you want it to.

[Spectre2689]

One word: MenuetOS Best. OS. EVER.

[EDIT] IS, my cousin has a Mac with Linux on it.

Edited by Spectre2689, 12 February 2004 - 09:44 PM.

[ItalionStallion]

Honestley I could care less, as long as it doesnt affect me and my windows XP i'm fine. Ive got soem friends who are really happy about this though.

Ohh and i cant stand MAC or Linux, they are both just...horrible.

[Ice Nine]

Fuck yes!
Linux and Mac and other non-Microsofters unite! Tear down the oppressive regime that is Microsoft, and have the ruins come crashing down upon Bill Gates' head!

Linux and OSX kick ass.

[Zero Talent]

How silly. You'd think it would be enough to just use a different OS, rather than wish hard times upon a multitude of industries.

I don't feel I have to time to curl into a new system, and I know a lot of other users will be bothered just the same. You'd think someone trying to make a hit at Microsoft would just bother Microsoft themselves, and not arbitrary computer users. This sucks.

[Alexthebeast]

For all of you saying you hate MS and that this is for the better, listen to this: MS is the proprietory OS for MANY companies. this would shut down a good deal of the internet and it's functions for while, home computors, business, cop cars, onstar, satillites (wich would utterly fall with a month without NASA control)....coplete utter chaos, and you sayit's for the better?

Bullshit.

[xedice]

For my whole life I have never used virus protection software, and have never caught a virus. Up until the past month....

Lately people are getting more and more clever, exploiting IE6 with weird html tags to get shit on your computer without you downloading a thing is just plain mean. And thats exactly what I caught. How the hell am I suppose to sleep at night now!? My computer is bare naked!

[Talio]

Fuck everyone of you who said that A, this won't affect you, and B you hate Microsoft.

If you hate Microsoft, don't use their fucking operating system. If you do use it, SHUT THE FUCK UP!!

Don't cry like a little bitch because someone smarter then you cornered the market. Yes windows is buggy, but it's closed source. What operating system is better for the average user? Linux? Mac OS? I think not.

And oh yeah, your happy. Fuck off. Yes as someone said before, there are still a huge number of servers running 2000 and NT. With the ability to expliot loopholes in the software, alot of servers will be fucked. Not to mention it could have negative effects on anti virus prices. All in all, when computers are as integrated into our society as they are, you will be effected. Oh, and I may be mistaken, but I beleive 2000 runs the same shell as Xp.

Fuck off, you guys hate Microsoft only because it sounds cool, yet I wouldn't bet half of you would be able to sit down and use a text based browser. Go to hell,

Talio.

[cxwq]

OK, first lets be clear that this is most likely not the entire Windows source tree. The torrent I saw was a ~220 Mb tarball which probably uncompresses to around 500-700 Mb.

Second, lets be clear that there is no evidence at this point that it is actually any part of Windows at all.

However, assuming that it is part of the Windows source tree, bad times are in store for all of you.

Microsoft screwed? Yup.

But you're screwed too, even if you use Linux, MacOS, or whatever.

Unless you've been sitting in a cave the last decade, Microsoft computers know all your bank account information. They have your credit card numbers, mother's maiden name, and SSN. They know about your doctor's visits and what prescriptions you've had filled. They know your shopping habits, online and otherwise. They know where you live, who you work for, and how much you make. They know how you did in school. They know who you send email to.

Millions of people depend on Windows to perform the daily tasks involved in their jobs. For many of them there is no alternative OS that is entirely suitable.

I have no love lost for Microsoft, but I use Windows because I'm paid to realistically evaluate the available products and implement the best overall solution for my department. For now, that's Windows.

[taita cakes]

Unless you've been sitting in a cave the last decade, Microsoft computers know all your bank account information. They have your credit card numbers, mother's maiden name, and SSN. They know about your doctor's visits and what prescriptions you've had filled. They know your shopping habits, online and otherwise. They know where you live, who you work for, and how much you make. They know how you did in school. They know who you send email to.

true enough cx, but the main point is, who is really dumb enough to trust every entity of their life, too a bunch of circuits and CRTs/LCD Pixels..... i mean, sure people fill out information like occupation, income, and names passworsd etc, but apart from the optomistic/ignorant [hard to differentiate] who else uses internet banking....

the smartest people who use computers are the one's who dont live for them, the ones who stand in line for about an hour at the local bank, actually get off their ass to buy groceries instead of typing in an adress and having them delivered..... and they say obesity isnt a problem?!?!?

[Ice Nine]

OK, first lets be clear that this is most likely not the entire Windows source tree. The torrent I saw was a ~220 Mb tarball which probably uncompresses to around 500-700 Mb.

Second, lets be clear that there is no evidence at this point that it is actually any part of Windows at all.

However, assuming that it is part of the Windows source tree, bad times are in store for all of you.

Microsoft screwed? Yup.

But you're screwed too, even if you use Linux, Mac OS, or whatever.

Unless you've been sitting in a cave the last decade, Microsoft computers know all your bank account information. They have your credit card numbers, mother's maiden name, and SSN. They know about your doctor's visits and what prescriptions you've had filled. They know your shopping habits, online and otherwise. They know where you live, who you work for, and how much you make. They know how you did in school. They know who you send email to.

Millions of people depend on Windows to perform the daily tasks involved in their jobs. For many of them there is no alternative OS that is entirely suitable.

I have no love lost for Microsoft, but I use Windows because I'm paid to realistically evaluate the available products and implement the best overall solution for my department. For now, that's Windows.

Err...
Yeah, I see your point now. However much I don't use Microsoft and love Linux and Mac OS, I can still see where it effects me. Wish I had known this earlier.
Anyways, I see there are ways for everyone to get butt-raped because of this, regardless of what OS they're running. Oh well, my bad, and I apologize.

Well, at least I don't have as much to lose because of this as some people, as I'm only thirteen (fourteen next wednesday!) and haven't even completed middle school yet. I don't have a job, nor a credit card number.

[Langley]

What I would be more interested in is the question of exactly how much more open is windows to attacks with the source code leaked? Does this put the ability to take down major systems quickly and easily into the hands of black-hat hackers? Or will everything be okay as long as Microsoft keeps up with security related patches and fixes.

[cxwq]

eEye discovered a security flaw in Windows. A major, remote compromise security flaw. They played nice and told MS about it.

MS asked them to keep it quiet and proceeded to take 6 months to release a patch.

Now, imagine that several dozen groups find holes in Windows with the help of the code. Wait, they... can't tell MS about it because it is illegal to have the code. So the first MS hears about it is when the worm hits the 'net. Thanks to the 'net, Windows malware spreads on a 12-48 hour timeline these days.

MS has relied for far too long on hiding their security flaws. If they are now out in the open, all hell will break loose.

Taita: You don't have to bank online for your bank to use Windows to store your information. When I drop by the Vons around the corner (pre-strike of course) for some milk, I'd guess about 90% of people are using those club cards. What do you want to bet that the data Vons keeps about shopping habits is on a MS system? Someone you know buying a house? Bet the mortgage information is on a MS system. How 'bout if you get badly injured and the hospital ER is in a panic and has a 6 hour backlog because all their computers went down?

[neonerfer]

...eEye found a HUGE security leak...


One word: MenuetOS Best. OS. EVER.

[EDIT] IS, my cousin has a Mac with Linux on it.

Someone's been watching their Screen Savers. eEye didn't find one major security hole though, they found eight. Microsoft hasn't bothered to fix the others ones, they're "still testing." Twin edged sword, you want to have the update fast but you also want it to be a stable one and not kill your computer when you install it.

[Spectre2689]

Someone's been watching their Screen Savers.    eEye didn't find one major security hole though, they found eight.  Microsoft hasn't bothered to fix the others ones, they're "still testing."

Screen Savers is the only way to go man. I never knew they found eight holes though. And people know about this. And the guys at MS are sitting on their happy little asses, and picking daisies in the field. How damn long does it take to test a patch? Six months? Fucking ridiculous...

And about everything running on MS? Bullshit. Yes, a lot of companies do run off of MS, but a lot also run off of Macs. Macs are more user-friendly than MS systems, and don't give you the Blue Screen if you try to open said application after getting said error for trying to delete said program for said reason. I think that instead of trying to always make things better and better and trying to jump ahead of everyone, they should just make it work properly. I would rather be using a 98 SE system with ALL the bugs fixed, than be using an XP system with holes in it. Hackers aren't idiots, they'll find the holes, and they'll screw over everyones computer. I got the MS Blast worm a few weeks ago, AFTER I had got the latest patch. Does that tell you anything? (Luckily my anti-virus found it, put it in a bag, shot it, and dumped it in the river).

And Talio...the only reason I run XP is because I haven't found a decent emulator to run games for Linux yet. Otherwise you'd be sure that I'd be using Linux. No contest.

[EDIT] This is the CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Station) news report on the security leak on Microsoft OS'.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last Updated Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:00:53
WASHINGTON - Microsoft warned customers Tuesday about a serious security problem with its Windows software, saying users should download a patch immediately.



In its monthly security bulletin, the world's largest software maker said Windows NT, Windows 2000, Windows XP software, along with Windows NT Server, Server 2000 and Server 2003 were affected.

It could allow hackers to break into computers and steal or delete files.

The company, which said it learned about the problem six months ago, called the threat "critical," its highest rating.

The flaw is "an extremely deep and pervasive technology in Windows," said Microsoft security executive Stephen Toulouse.

Customers can download a patch on Microsoft's website.

"It is a critical situation so we'd ask people to address it as promptly as they can," said Jill Schoolenberg, a spokesperson for Microsoft Canada.

eEye Digital Security Inc. discovered the Windows flaw in July 2003, but agreed to keep quiet until Microsoft fixed the problem.

A spokesperson for eEye Digital called the six-month period it took Microsoft to inform the public "totally unacceptable," saying Windows users were vulnerable during that time.



Written by CBC News Online staff

Edited by Spectre2689, 13 February 2004 - 01:14 PM.

[cxwq]

And about everything running on MS? Bullshit. Yes, a lot of companies do run off of MS, but a lot also run off of Macs.

We're talking about database servers here, not graphic designers. Do you think your private information is being stored on someone's desktop machine?

The database world is all about Windows and UNIX. The Windows DBMS market is growing at about 11% annually while the UNIX market is in decline. Nobody uses Mac for large scale database work.

While we're at it, nobody uses Macs for much of anything outside of the design world. Apple has less than a 3% worldwide market share. Early last year, Apple was the 9th leading computer manufacturer. Think about that. There are 8 companies making PCs that ship more computers than Apple does.

[neonerfer]

I think that instead of trying to always make things better and better and trying to jump ahead of everyone, they should just make it work properly. I would rather be using a 98 SE system with ALL the bugs fixed, than be using an XP system with holes in it. Hackers aren't idiots, they'll find the holes, and they'll screw over everyones computer.

Well, the latest version of XP is exponentially more secure than an up to date 98 SE machine. Does Microsoft even offer support and updates for pre-2000 software?

[Black Wrath]

Well, the latest version of XP is exponentially more secure than an up to date 98 SE machine. Does Microsoft even offer support and updates for pre-2000 software?

If you want to spend hours upon hours searching through the site and databases, sure, you'll find something... it's not like it will be worth downloading, but it may be a security update like a new plugin for firewalls or something useless for a pre-2000 computer like that.

[cxwq]

Does Microsoft even offer support and updates for pre-2000 software?

No.

Win 95/98/ME/NT are all End Of Life.

And they're ending OEM and retail license availability for Win2k Pro next month.

[xedice]

98 was as stable as f**k. But ever since my switch to 2000, I've had problems with security. I would have to disagree with XP being more secure than win98, just in my personal case, I've never had a problem with win98.

Edited by xedice, 13 February 2004 - 05:04 PM.

[cxwq]

98 was as stable as f**k. But ever since my switch to 2000, I've had problems with security. I would have to disagree with XP being more secure than win98, just in my personal case, I've never had a problem with win98.

Win2k is targeted by black hats because:

1. It can do much more than 9x.

2. It is much more common than 9x.

Win98 stable?! If we're talking personal experience, I used to administer a network consisting of 40 Win98 machines that I upgraded 3 years ago to Win2k Pro. Under 98, my users averaged a crash a day, more for users who actually pushed their systems hard. Under 2k, my department averages one crash a day.

Anecdotal? Yes, but it meshes nicely with what other system admins report and that is a very large stability increase.

Win9x was unmaintainable, that's why they killed it and pushed the 2k kernel into the home market. The 2k kernel was originally written by the guys who did VMS and it is vastly superior to how the MS team wrote 9x.

[taita cakes]

heh, i love having a gay computer, i run 98, and all this talk about the Blaster and Well Cheer virii that my dad freaked out about and had me download or search for all the patches, dont even effect 98, there aimed at all the win2k+ as one of you said...

ohh and cx, damn rite about teh internet banking thing, didnt reAally think about it, and i thought the same thing about the win2k+ being more widespread, why take out 98 when its only what, 20% of computer users OS [rough guess of course]