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Bullpup Design?

Anyone famliar with it?

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#1 stryd

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 04:57 PM

Rear magazine loading gun.

The FAMAS and the P90 are types of Bullpup guns and after googleing and you tubeing Bullpup guns... I think a shell can be prepared for any Nerf Gun to make it more ergonomic.

I have the design's working over in my head Utilizing Plexiglass (or what ever you guys refer to it as). I bring this up though to see if any one else had any similar ideas and if so possibily helping each other in the design(s).

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FAMAS

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AK-47 in Bullpup form

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Some gun... :huh:

And the you tube video that helped me understand how a Conversion could be possible. look into 4:50 if you want to skip ahead to understand my inspiration.

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#2 Salindin Naz

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:01 PM

I think it would be nearly impossible without MASSIVE modifications. A real gun works on a percussive "hammer" striking the back of the bullet known as the "primer". In a real firearm, the ammunition IS the propellant. Nerf gun use air, not gunpowder, and therefore have a propellant outside of the ammunition. To simplify; bullets propel themselves (more-or-less), while darts require an external propellant in the rear of the dart. Were you to put a mag into the stock of your LS you would need to move the plunger tube behind it, thus no longer allowing your LS to be "Bull-pup".

But if you can do it, and prove me wrong, I'll be extremely impressed.


Salindin


Your last three posts were closed BE VARY CAREFULL. This will not go over well with the admins.

Edited by Salindin_Naz, 19 February 2009 - 05:02 PM.

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#3 stryd

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:22 PM

I am sorry about the last... three...? I thought they were 2. Oh well I already conveyed i was sorry about the posting problem and i believe that it was due to either my comp or the Server 500 Internal Error message that was received on my end.

About the conversion. The ergonomics of the Bullpup shell is what intrigues me. I am sure there is a possibility to use air or spring in some manner with a clip system... but as you said though that would become a more of a Homemade major over haul of a gun.

But to make a shell to go around the gun to make it ergonomic, that would be great. Like some type of shell that would go around a BBB and help shorten the length of having to "charge" the gun. That is the design that has had my mind a tinkering since yesterday.

I refer back to 4:50 of the youtube vid. That is the shell and trigger system that sparked my inspiration.
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#4 BustaNinja

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:45 PM

The P90 isn't a bullpup. It just has a helix mag, but it still feeds infront of the trigger.
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#5 Draconis

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:50 PM

The real hurdle, like Salindin was stating, is the problem is getting a worthwhile plunger in that limited space behind the darts and barrel. Take the Firefly. It has similar ergonomics to the bullpup designs, and is actually quite large. But there is only enough space for a crappy little plunger. This certainly would be easier with an air gun than springer.
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#6 CaptainSlug

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:53 PM

The length of a normal configuration springer is determined by the plunger tube length, plunger stroke, and barrel length. You can reduce the total length significantly by
1. Using the barrel as the plunger (like is done in the Scout). But figuring out a simple and fast means of loading such a configuration when the barrel length is increased beyond 4-inches can be difficult.
2. Putting a 180 degree bend in the connection between the plunger tube and barrel.

The P90 isn't a bullpup.

Yes it is.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90
The helical ramp is rearward of the midpoint of the gun, the ejection chute is on the underside, and all of the action components are behind the trigger.

I think a shell can be prepared for any Nerf Gun to make it more ergonomic.

You are wrong. An you end up with handholds that are unnaturally far apart. The handle you would be using to prime the plunger will end up at the opposite end of the blaster from the primary grip.

Edited by CaptainSlug, 19 February 2009 - 06:02 PM.

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#7 BustaNinja

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 05:58 PM

You can't really make a bullpup springer Nerf gun without making it longer than it was to beging with, or putting a 180 degree bend in the connection between the plunger tube and barrel.
The length of a normal configuration springer is determined by the plunger tube length, plunger stroke, and barrel length. You can reduce the total length significantly by using the barrel as the plunger (like is done in the Scout). But figuring out a simple and fast means of loading such a configuration when the barrel length is increased beyond 4-inches can be difficult.

The P90 isn't a bullpup.

Yes it is. The helical ramp is rearward of the midpoint of the gun, the ejection chute is on the underside, and all of the action components are behind the trigger.

I think a shell can be prepared for any Nerf Gun to make it more ergonomic.

You are wrong.

Damn, you are right. Its been a while since firing one, but yeah.

Also, my friend wanted to make shells for SNAPs, however, why would you want to? I would suggest making a home made Nerf gun, then you don't need to change anything.
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#8 SchizophrenicMC

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:01 PM

I think a shell can be prepared for any Nerf Gun to make it more ergonomic.

You are wrong.

No, the shell is no problem if you can make it. The problem is it's hard to make.

Had I the materials, I could, in essence, fit my Magstrike into the LS's more ergonomic design.

However, I lack said materials.

I may actually try that.
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QUOTE(NerfUK @ May 8 2009, 11:54 AM) View Post

(I forgot to take a picture of my own poppers)

QUOTE(analogkid @ May 20 2009, 10:04 PM) View Post

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#9 Captain

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:16 PM

The real hurdle, like Salindin was stating, is the problem is getting a worthwhile plunger in that limited space behind the darts and barrel. Take the Firefly. It has similar ergonomics to the bullpup designs, and is actually quite large. But there is only enough space for a crappy little plunger. This certainly would be easier with an air gun than springer.

Well actually, there is a LOT of empty space in the back of the firefly. There's room for a bigger plunger, but why they used such a small one instead is something I'll never know.
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#10 foxdemon82

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:31 PM

It could possibly be done but only as a homemade I highly doubt that your gonna be able to mod ANY baster to fire bullpup. Aslo another problem with the bull pup design is for the most part the barrel is inside the gun Making it have the accuracy of an assualt rifle but the size of a sub-machine gun....This would not work for a nerf gun as for one the plunger size would be small in length and not being able to fire the dart all the way out the barrel making it basically look like the nerf gun is taking a crap also if the dart gets stuck in the barrel good luck getting it out.
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QUOTE(Glint @ Feb 15 2009, 07:07 PM) View Post

So stop with all the "new Recon" crap. This thing definately isn't a Recon, I'll wager my soul. Someone can quote me on that if they'd like

#11 Salindin Naz

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:39 PM

Look inside the BuzzBee RFR.




You still don't have the mag loaded into the stock on a RFR. That is one of the main requirements in a bull-pup.

I'm not saying that it can't be done, but that it would be VERY difficult.
Salindin

Edited by Salindin_Naz, 19 February 2009 - 06:40 PM.

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#12 death by cheez

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:41 PM

Just custom make a FAR rifle to shoot that way.
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#13 foxdemon82

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:52 PM

easier said then done cheez

Edited by foxdemon82, 19 February 2009 - 06:53 PM.

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QUOTE(Glint @ Feb 15 2009, 07:07 PM) View Post

So stop with all the "new Recon" crap. This thing definately isn't a Recon, I'll wager my soul. Someone can quote me on that if they'd like

#14 Salindin Naz

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 06:59 PM

eaiser said then done cheez



My point exactly. To make a true bull-pup, you would need to relocate the trigger, mag, plunger, (though Bob does raise a very valid point in the use of tubing to solve this problem) and in most, if not all cases, the barrel. A pump gun could be used to better effect, though it would need to have a magazine, such as a Magstrike. Maybe flywheels could be used as well to get around the whole plunger issue, but in all cases this would be a massive under taking, requiring a lot of time and material. I still stand by my first post, please any of you make one, and I will be very impressed.

Salindin
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#15 slowguitarman

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 07:14 PM

Why are you all complicating things? If you really want a bullpup LS, you can make a grip with trigger in front of the mag and attach that trigger to the original. Then cut the original grip off. It would be pointless, in my opinion, but fairly easy.
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#16 BustaNinja

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 07:24 PM

Why are you all complicating things? If you really want a bullpup LS, you can make a grip with trigger in front of the mag and attach that trigger to the original. Then cut the original grip off. It would be pointless, in my opinion, but fairly easy.

Actually it would be a pretty cool idea, as then you would have the full stock without the length of the full Longshot, thus making a more true to the word Longshot carbine. it would be pretty awesome for indoor wars. You would just have to take off the regular stock.
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#17 foxdemon82

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 08:21 PM

I may try to sketch up a homemade with this design (making the catch will be unbearable though)
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QUOTE(Glint @ Feb 15 2009, 07:07 PM) View Post

So stop with all the "new Recon" crap. This thing definately isn't a Recon, I'll wager my soul. Someone can quote me on that if they'd like

#18 maxxxem

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 09:00 PM

I am working on a micro Tavor (look it up)
it will be able to use longshot mags
I have thought about 3 versions
-Spring: boltaction with reverse plunger to conserve space
-semi-auto: uses a FLY. When you pull the trigger it pushes the dart forward where the wheeles will pull it out and fire
-Full-auto: spins a wheel which rubs agenst the top of the dart (while in mag) which pulls it into the wheels

Using a spring is verry hard to put into the space of the rear of the gun. Using a FLY system requires less space. I did tha math and if you wanted the gun to shoot as far as a BBB you would need about 6 cubic inches of air to get the same ranges. But it is possable.
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#19 maxxxem

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 09:04 PM

I am working on a micro Tavor
it will be able to use longshot mags
I have thought about 3 versions
-Spring: boltaction with reverse plunger to conserve space
-semi-auto: uses a FLY. When you pull the trigger it pushes the dart forward where the wheeles will pull it out and fire
-Full-auto: spins a wheel which rubs agenst the top of the dart (while in mag) which pulls it into the wheels
"--Modify a blaster for a kid and he'll be entertained for a week. Teach him how to modify blasters and he'll become an engineer--"

Believe you can and you're half way there.
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#20 TheNerfLoki

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 09:27 PM

1. Bullpup homemade Link .

2.That would not work unless you made it an airgun or in a design like the 4bp, because the rear space of a springer contains the spring.Any length you would be able to get rid of by making it a true bullpup, you would have to add to the end of the gun to accommodate the spring

3.It works in firearms because It allows you to move the barrel into the body of the firearm. But even the bullpup firearms have tons of problems. The L85A1 had to go through several revisions before it was as effective as it is today.

4. You would use polycarbonate, not plexiglas

Maxxem, you double posted.
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#21 foxdemon82

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 09:38 PM

Carbon's idea was genius but a true bullpup design has everything nested in the buttstock area (not a pipe above the rest of the gun....no offense carbon)

also the bullpup design has a flaw that can not be fixed at all.....

On a real bullpup the reciver is right next to your face if the bullet were to explode (which HAS happened but it is extremely rare as ammunition is tougher than anything I know) you would be losing half your face
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QUOTE(Glint @ Feb 15 2009, 07:07 PM) View Post

So stop with all the "new Recon" crap. This thing definately isn't a Recon, I'll wager my soul. Someone can quote me on that if they'd like

#22 TheDisciple

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 10:10 PM

Nerf Haven is some kind of fantastic Hivemind, I was thinking about bullpups a few days ago

What if you just had a very extended trigger assembly, slice the trigger and pistol grip drag it up front, and use some machined plastic to replace the long end....I suppose the idea is a bit convoluted
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#23 halfway33

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 10:28 PM

I'm wondering...... whats the advantage of having a bullpup nerf gun? its just a shit load of work for minimal gain in my opinion. plus, I think front heavy guns are more comfy for me. (even though the firefly was my first nerf gun)
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#24 Greed

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 11:15 PM

Hmm...

Does it have to be a springer? A bullpup could be done with an air gun where a tube connecting the air tank to the barrel goes back to the stock behind a clip.
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#25 cheesypiza001

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Posted 20 February 2009 - 12:36 AM

Hmm...

Does it have to be a springer? A bullpup could be done with an air gun where a tube connecting the air tank to the barrel goes back to the stock behind a clip.


That reminds me of Boltsniper's Bullpup Tactical Rifle.
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