25 replies to this topic

[penguin807]

So, I learned a valuable lesson tonight when actually measuring my LS' range. IT DOES NOT SHOOT 80 feet. More like 40 (It's decently modified too). I also learned that every single range claim I have posted on this site has been an exaduration.

I think it is time to come up with a universal range testing system.

Here are the things I think that should be done when you are seeing how far your Nerf gun shoots.

1. Use a 100ft measure reel for your ranges. Not your foot, not your step, not a ruler, a 100ft tape measure reel. They can be picked up at any hardware store or ordered online. They look like this.



2. Do not pick up the best made darts from your collection for the range test. During a Nerf war, you won't have time to rummage through your pockets searching for your best made Stefans.

3. For your range testing, pick up at least 10 darts from your collection for the testing

4. Get a friend, mom, brother, or some other person to vouch for your range claim and make sure when you're firing your blaster that the barrel is parallel to the ground. That's means a 0 degree angle.

5. Lay out your tape measure reel. All 100 feet of it. If you don't have room in your backyard, go to a park or something.

6. Load your dart (s) into your barrel (s) like you would in a Nerf war. That means no ram roding. Now do you understand the practicality of a breach or coupler?

7. Once you get an OK from your range testing buddy, pull the trigger.

8. Repeat 6 & 7 until you have no remaining darts.

9. Walk along your tape measure reel until you find your first dart. Record the range and move on until you get to your last dart.

10. Repeat steps 6-9 one more time

11. Now you have your ranges for ONE day.

12. If you want to be super accurate with your ranges (you do) repeat all steps during randomly chosen times in the week.

Suggestions or concerns?

Edited by penguin807, 29 May 2008 - 09:51 PM.

[mystefansdontflystraight]

This is exactly what the NIC needs. No more of that 150ft Nf bull. I think anyone who posts BS ranges should be refered to this, and see if this is what they did.
Thanks, and good job.

[Jtcm]

Seems like a good system. This is how I test all my ranges. But I am curious as to what you did to throw your ranges off but 40'?

Edited by Jtcm, 29 May 2008 - 09:32 PM.

[Galaxy613]

Frankly, some people DO ramrod barrels in a nerf war. Granted they have a longer reload time than breeches, but the diffuculty to remove a coupler, put a dart in, put the coupler back on is about the same time it'll take to put a grab the ramrod, put the dart in, and ram it.

Otherwise penguin807, everything you stated here is what people SHOULD be doing ANYWAYS. At least that's how I've been brought to think. This is good to be spelled out to new people who don't know the correct way.

[doubleshot]

This should be stickied, it would clear up a lot of these BS threads about all these amazing ranges.

[NerfCrazy]

We need a set system like this for measuring ranges.

[raw shrimp]

As good as this sounds, someone will inevitably say the " I have one and my brother was there but my dad won't let me take the tape measure out of the shed" type of excuse.

And I agree with Galaxy

Edited by raw shrimp, 29 May 2008 - 09:50 PM.

[badger]

You also have to take into consideration temperature, humidity, wind, and even altitude when trying to come up with the perfect measurement system.

My Max Shot shoots pretty far, about 90 feet, but it shoots shorter distances in the winter time as the spring is cold. It will most likely shoot farther at higher altitudes as the air is thinner. During the summer, it should get longer ranges, but if it is very humid, performance can be hindered as the air density's effect on the darts is greater than on a dry day. Where a person lives and the current conditions can alter ranges. Two identical mods and groupings of darts can shoot different distances in different places.

Having a system in place for how one should calculate proper ranges is a good idea (though the witness can be omitted if you are trustworthy, I mean, who is going to want to sit around and watch you shoot a children's toy at nothing...if I was that person, I would take one of your guns and shoot you for wasting time measuring ranges for bragging rights and not nerfing instead, but I digress) but it still won't eliminate the variances that can occur through the beforementioned conditions, errors, or just straight up fuckin' lying. By the way, if someone doesn't test the ranges this way, will their results be called bullshit?

This won't stop the shit ranges from being posted, but it is a good start.

But once again, who really fuckin' cares how far it shoots. In the end, it comes down to skill, not range as to who will win the round. A LBB and a BBBB outclass a X-Bow for range by far, but I've watched VACC and Groove own anyone that uses them with their X-Bows.

Just go out and nerf, for fuck's sake!

[BustaNinja]

Now that means I need to be a cheap stake and see if my science teacher will let my borrow the measuring tape.

But good idea, but I kinda got to agree with badger, just go nerf, know how far your gun shoots on the feild, and have fun.

[TED]

Ummmmm there already is a universal range test.

Step 1: Mod gun

Step 2:...

Step:3: 110' ranges

[Shadow 92]

I may not be practical for most people, but someone posted a write up on how to use some freeware and a set of mics to measure velocity. I've always liked seeing power in terms of FPS because it eliminates any angling.

[penguin807]

Very true Badger.

But the whole reason we post ranges here in the NIC is to share to others about the power of the blaster, but of course most of the ranges you see around here are complete nonsense. The goal of this was not to instituite a new system that will revolutionize the way members post about ranges, it was just an oppinion about how I think ranges should be measured to inform those who aren't aware, or to those who know and just plain don't do it.


But in the end (as you stated) it all matters about skill in a Nerf war.

[el swifto]

Also, while you have your testing buddy out there, have them check to see where the darts actually land.


But I don't think even stickying this thread will completely prevent people from posting outrageous ranges. It's too much work and not really that worth it.

[Bomberman]

I agree with Badger on this one. This will help newer members that are acually worth being members here at nerfhaven, but the real culprits of posting the BS range threads are stupid jackasses that don't give a shit about the true spirit of nerfing, and just want some self-confidence on some online forum. It's pretty sad when you think about it. But penguin, good job, and I do think this will be benificial in at least a few respects.

[A side of nerf]

I was thinking it would be good to collect the average ranges of most popular guns (longshot, nitefinder, maverick, etc...) and class them in a table according to mod. This would help some to see if they are getting close to the average range.
The table would look something like this,

It seems like a lot of work but it would help people from getting flamed for posting bogus ranges.
-A side of nerf

[Lynx]

Hey, A Side' we already have that in all mods and in our experience we know how much a certain mod can help.

There are different things that can help a gun in different ways that makes that system less likely to work.

• Conditions when testing (different angles, temperature, humidity)
• Certain mods need other mods for full benefit (a NF with a #49 with air restrictors won't help much)
• Bull shit (it will always occur, even a little)
• Finally, UNCE UNCE UNCE

That sums it up pretty well.

[keef]

Dark Shrimp you forgot some.

Step 1: Mod gun

Step 2:...

Step:3: 110' ranges

Step4:?????

Step5: PROFIT!!!!

[TED]

I didn't forget shit... asshole.

[Thom]

There's another important variable that seems to be neglected: height above ground. Ideally, range should be proportion to the square root of the height of the gun.

[Lynx]

Maybe this concept will transfer to male penis size:

sqrt(Gun height)=Range

sqrt(Male height)=Penis

sqrt(63")= 7.973..."

I say it's true! (/sarcasm)

Edited by Lynx, 01 June 2008 - 10:47 PM.

[Split]

There's another important variable that seems to be neglected: height above ground. Ideally, range should be proportion to the square root of the height of the gun.

Sounds like bs to me. Just because something is in proportion to or proportional to something else, that doesn't mean it's a 1:1 ratio. That's why it is proportional. If it was a 1:1 ratio, you're saying something close to what lynx just said.
Range=sqrt(height of gun)
Sqrt(5'5"=65" (avg shoulder height (close enough)))= 8.06225775"

So, since there is obviously a proportion here, there's no point at all for there being a square root in here at all. I mean hell, fundamentally, the range should be as far as it can possibly go. Either that or infinite. And no one wants to get into that.

[Thom]

I never said it was a 1:1 ratio. Obviously, it can't be. But crunch the equations and you will find that I'm right. The upshot being that if we're trying for consistent ranges, picking a standard height, such as five feet, would be beneficial.

[Split]

No, you're not right. Because there is no relationship between what the range should be and the height of the gun.

[Peter]

No, you're not right. Because there is no relationship between what the range should be and the height of the gun.

Please tell me you're joking?

You also speak of square roots and why they have no place? I am not supporting anything said before as it doesn't make any sense at all, there is no constant ratio between initial height and final displacement.

However: xfinal = xinitial + vo*t - .5at^2

likewise, for gravity we are looking at:

y-final (0) = y-initial - 4.9t^2

so

sqrt(-yinitial/4.9) = t

therefore: xfinal = vo*sqrt(-yinitial/4.9) - [ .5a* -yinitial/4.9 ]

There you go. Initial height (yinitial) matters very much to the final range of your gun. However, like I said before, there is no constant between the final range and initial height.

Initial height has a huge factor in the final displacement of a projectile, but it doesn't really matter for nerfing, since the average human height is going to be around 5~ feet anyway.

[Blacksunshine]

holy shit you guys are taking it way to far. All these silly calculations. A gun a dart and a tape measure. thats all you need. Yeah a person that it 7 ft tall might a couple more feet range then someone that is 5'6". But its not going to be substantial enough to make a huge diff. Also you have to keep in mind there is an average height that most people will fall into that gives us a standard expectation of height of gun. So all these calculations are simply over complicating things.

Altho this is a great write up and explanation. The idea is lost on those that are the greatest offenders. Because they are not about to go and drop 14-20 bucks on a 100' measuring tape. (tho Harbor freight has a 1000' walking tape measure on sale right now for 6.99) thats money well spent on another gun, some fbr, some petg/brass or herb. For those that are willing to drop the coin and are honest enough not to BS the NIC. This is a great guide to accurately measure distances.